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Home > Archive > Lasik Eyes Surgery > May 2005 > I plan to get LASIK... Any suggestions or tips?
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I plan to get LASIK... Any suggestions or tips?
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| Raffi 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Hello LASIK newsgroup. I'm a 22 year old male and I have nearsightedness.
I've been wearing glasses for much of my young adult life. Now I plan to get
Wavefront-guided LASIK treatment so I won't have to wear glasses anymore. I
have an appointment on Monday, May 16th, at Caster Eye Center of Beverly
Hills for an initial consultation. But surgory is a big deal, and so I
thought I'd come to a news group to read up on any issues that I may need to
be aware of. I must say that some of the posts here have scared me, such as
the one titled "Imagine a truthful LASIK seminar"...
If it came to making a decision between wearing glasses and having damaged
eyes, of course I'd choose to wear glasses. I just want my eyes to be safe.
And that's why I am thinking of getting Wavefront-guided LASIK with what I
take to be a prominent LASIK surgeon in a well-to-do part of Los Angeles.
The treatment will cost 5,800.
I plan to get my treatment done by Caster Eye Center - Here is the website:
http://www.1lasiklasereyesurgerydrcaster.com/
I'd appreciate it if you could give me suggestions, advice, tips. I want to
get the best possible treatment, but I also want to be informed of the
likely side-effects of this surgery. And I'm not sure I can take posts like
"imagine a truthful LASIK seminar" to be totally accurate, because the
author of such posts may be biased by having a particularly bad experience,
that may have been done by a lesser quality surgeon. Or does it make a
difference? I'm all ears, please let me know before I get this done.
Thank you.
Raffi.
| |
| Glenn - USAEyes.org 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Yes, many of the posts here will frighten someone from refractive
surgery. That is their purpose. A few people post here multiple
times and under many names with sometimes inflated stories of LASIK
problems. You need to be careful not to believe everything you read.
You need to be equally careful not to dismiss everything you read,
either. People do have poor outcomes, even now, but the vast majority
are satisfied with their results.
LASIK is surgery and there is no perfect surgery. There is always
risk. What is very important for you is to evaluate your potential
benefit against your potential risk based upon your individual
circumstances. You wouldn't wear your friend's contact lenses, nor
should you consider someone else's result - good or bad - indicative
of what you will get.
Keep in mind too that there is a tremendous difference between
probability and possibility. There are a gazillion things that can go
wrong with LASIK, just like there are a gazillion things that can kill
you every day. It is the probability that is more important to
reasonable people than just the possibility.
The most you can expect from LASIK is the convenience of a reduced
need for corrective lenses. To achieve that convenience, you will
need to accept some risk.
If after evaluation by a competent doctor you are uncomfortable with
your individual probabilities, then simply don't have surgery. This
is an elective procedure and nobody is forcing you to go under the
laser.
If you have not already, please visit our websites and take a look at
the information there. Hopefully it will help you make an informed
decision.
Glenn Hagele
Executive Director
USAEyes.org
"Consider and Choose With Confidence"
Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
http://www.USAEyes.org
http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
I am not a doctor.
| |
| ycdbsoya 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Raffi:
I would go to a couple more clinics to triangulate to who's "best." Dr.
Brian Boxer-Wachler, Dr. James Salz and a few other outstanding
surgeons are also up in that neck of the woods. Do not under any
circumstances let price be a deciding factor. It is greatly dependent
on surgeon skill and experience, and since this is a one-shot deal (you
can't ever go back) you need to be 110% certain. Take your time, get
multiple opinions and make multiple contacts. See Glenn's CRQSA site
for the "5o Tough Questions to Ask Your Doctor." .
| |
| Ragnar 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| $5800? That sounds a bit on the expensive end of the spectrum to me.
He's on Wilshire in Beverly Hills... You are paying a premium by
going to a surgeon who is in such a ritzy neighborhood.
Anyway, I'd suggest you ignore this newsgroup entirely. You will get
more misinformation here than useful information. If you have
specific questions, you might want to ask them here just to see the
crazy responses you get.
On Fri, 13 May 2005 07:09:05 -0700, "Raffi" <jssj@fzyo.com> wrote:
>Hello LASIK newsgroup. I'm a 22 year old male and I have nearsightedness.
>I've been wearing glasses for much of my young adult life. Now I plan to get
>Wavefront-guided LASIK treatment so I won't have to wear glasses anymore. I
>have an appointment on Monday, May 16th, at Caster Eye Center of Beverly
>Hills for an initial consultation. But surgory is a big deal, and so I
>thought I'd come to a news group to read up on any issues that I may need to
>be aware of. I must say that some of the posts here have scared me, such as
>the one titled "Imagine a truthful LASIK seminar"...
>
>If it came to making a decision between wearing glasses and having damaged
>eyes, of course I'd choose to wear glasses. I just want my eyes to be safe.
>And that's why I am thinking of getting Wavefront-guided LASIK with what I
>take to be a prominent LASIK surgeon in a well-to-do part of Los Angeles.
>The treatment will cost 5,800.
>
>I plan to get my treatment done by Caster Eye Center - Here is the website:
>http://www.1lasiklasereyesurgerydrcaster.com/
>
>I'd appreciate it if you could give me suggestions, advice, tips. I want to
>get the best possible treatment, but I also want to be informed of the
>likely side-effects of this surgery. And I'm not sure I can take posts like
>"imagine a truthful LASIK seminar" to be totally accurate, because the
>author of such posts may be biased by having a particularly bad experience,
>that may have been done by a lesser quality surgeon. Or does it make a
>difference? I'm all ears, please let me know before I get this done.
>
>Thank you.
>
>
>Raffi.
>
| |
| Simpledog 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| I would see Salz, Rabinowitz, Assil, Boxer-Wachler as well. They'll do a
free pre-op consult for you. There is no harm in getting a pre-op second
opinion.
"Raffi" <jssj@fzyo.com> wrote in message
news:4y2he.11467$fY4.8192@fe07.lga...
> Hello LASIK newsgroup. I'm a 22 year old male and I have nearsightedness.
> I've been wearing glasses for much of my young adult life. Now I plan to
> get
> Wavefront-guided LASIK treatment so I won't have to wear glasses anymore.
> I
> have an appointment on Monday, May 16th, at Caster Eye Center of Beverly
> Hills for an initial consultation. But surgory is a big deal, and so I
> thought I'd come to a news group to read up on any issues that I may need
> to
> be aware of. I must say that some of the posts here have scared me, such
> as
> the one titled "Imagine a truthful LASIK seminar"...
>
> If it came to making a decision between wearing glasses and having damaged
> eyes, of course I'd choose to wear glasses. I just want my eyes to be
> safe.
> And that's why I am thinking of getting Wavefront-guided LASIK with what I
> take to be a prominent LASIK surgeon in a well-to-do part of Los Angeles.
> The treatment will cost 5,800.
>
> I plan to get my treatment done by Caster Eye Center - Here is the
> website:
> http://www.1lasiklasereyesurgerydrcaster.com/
>
> I'd appreciate it if you could give me suggestions, advice, tips. I want
> to
> get the best possible treatment, but I also want to be informed of the
> likely side-effects of this surgery. And I'm not sure I can take posts
> like
> "imagine a truthful LASIK seminar" to be totally accurate, because the
> author of such posts may be biased by having a particularly bad
> experience,
> that may have been done by a lesser quality surgeon. Or does it make a
> difference? I'm all ears, please let me know before I get this done.
>
> Thank you.
>
>
> Raffi.
>
>
| |
| ycdbsoya 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Hey Raffi:
We apologize for Ragnar. He cannot help himself, and suffers from
rectocranial inversion syndrome (RIS). He was abandoned by his mother
and beaten up by girls in elementary school, but he is a real person.
Honest!
He will always be on the bottom of your shoe, so please just wipe him
off before entering this room.
$5,800 does seem high, but Wavefront generally gets a 20-30% premium
over standard RS. Prices have come down in recent years thanks to price
pressure from LASIK mills, but the best still charge the most. There's
a reason.
| |
| Debbie 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Dear Raffi,
You will always have a 'split cornea' after LASIK because the underside of
the flap never heals. This split cornea will always be more susceptible to
traumatic injury and infection.
Your corneal neves will be cut during LASIK, and recent studies show that
the nerves don't grow back all the way.. and are still decreasing at the 3
year point when one of the longer studies ended.
Young men your age have had their vision trashed and have permanent
discomfort from LASIK dry eye.
LASIK is a risky surgery and living with a bad outcome is hell. Glasses
aren't so bad. Learn to love them. Buy yourself some new glasses and a
really HOT CAR. Or something else you really want.
If you are concerned about the contents of 'Imagine a Truthful LASIK
Seminar why don't you Google a site called PubMed. It is searchable by key
words and you can read all sorts of articles about LASIK complications.
I talked to a doctor at a major university Medical Center's LASIK office who
told me about 10% of patients have visual side-effects that are not recorded
on a SNELLEN chart (black and white eye chart). Many doctors just use the
SNELLEN chart and tell the public that LASIK is GREAT, meanwhile patients
have visual distortions, night vision problems, dry eye... you get the
picture.
When I asked this doctor if he TELLS patients that 10% end up with these
problems all I got by way of reply was a stony silence.
LASIK isn't good for the eyes. There have been enough studies published
recently in good journals to back up this claim. One study looked at
post-mortem corneas and found that ALL of the post-LASIK corneas had
pathology.
Keep your eyes healthy and free of LASIK-induced problems.
Doesn't matter if you go to the 'best' surgeon. The 'best' surgeons still
have patients with bad outcomes, and your chances of having reduced contrast
sensitivity, corneal nerve damage and induced aberrations are prettty much a
sure thing.
"Raffi" <jssj@fzyo.com> wrote in message
news:4y2he.11467$fY4.8192@fe07.lga...
> Hello LASIK newsgroup. I'm a 22 year old male and I have nearsightedness.
> I've been wearing glasses for much of my young adult life. Now I plan to
> get
> Wavefront-guided LASIK treatment so I won't have to wear glasses anymore.
> I
> have an appointment on Monday, May 16th, at Caster Eye Center of Beverly
> Hills for an initial consultation. But surgory is a big deal, and so I
> thought I'd come to a news group to read up on any issues that I may need
> to
> be aware of. I must say that some of the posts here have scared me, such
> as
> the one titled "Imagine a truthful LASIK seminar"...
>
> If it came to making a decision between wearing glasses and having damaged
> eyes, of course I'd choose to wear glasses. I just want my eyes to be
> safe.
> And that's why I am thinking of getting Wavefront-guided LASIK with what I
> take to be a prominent LASIK surgeon in a well-to-do part of Los Angeles.
> The treatment will cost 5,800.
>
> I plan to get my treatment done by Caster Eye Center - Here is the
> website:
> http://www.1lasiklasereyesurgerydrcaster.com/
>
> I'd appreciate it if you could give me suggestions, advice, tips. I want
> to
> get the best possible treatment, but I also want to be informed of the
> likely side-effects of this surgery. And I'm not sure I can take posts
> like
> "imagine a truthful LASIK seminar" to be totally accurate, because the
> author of such posts may be biased by having a particularly bad
> experience,
> that may have been done by a lesser quality surgeon. Or does it make a
> difference? I'm all ears, please let me know before I get this done.
>
> Thank you.
>
>
> Raffi.
>
>
| |
| Debbie 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Plenty of people, myself for example, had their eyes trashed by LASIK in
only ONE surgery. The person Glenn is alluding to (who had multiple
surgeries) had HORRENDOUS topographies - was so decentered it was
outrageous. I have seen the topographies. You can't fix a decentration with
glasses. More surgeries were indicated for this person.
Glenn may actually know this but he makes his living pimping LASIK, so he's
not about to confess. Glenn wears glasses himself because he doesn't want to
play the numbers game and risk a bad outcome.
Good advice for all of you out there. Be like Glenn in this one respect...
don't get LASIK. In most other respects I'd suggest avoiding emulating
Glenn.
"Glenn - USAEyes.org" <glenn.hageleSTOPSPAM@USAEyes.org> wrote in message
news:f2f981ls2dcdd438e2sieibga66jfiaifm@4ax.com...
> Yes, many of the posts here will frighten someone from refractive
> surgery. That is their purpose. A few people post here multiple
> times and under many names with sometimes inflated stories of LASIK
> problems. You need to be careful not to believe everything you read.
> You need to be equally careful not to dismiss everything you read,
> either. People do have poor outcomes, even now, but the vast majority
> are satisfied with their results.
>
> LASIK is surgery and there is no perfect surgery. There is always
> risk. What is very important for you is to evaluate your potential
> benefit against your potential risk based upon your individual
> circumstances. You wouldn't wear your friend's contact lenses, nor
> should you consider someone else's result - good or bad - indicative
> of what you will get.
>
> Keep in mind too that there is a tremendous difference between
> probability and possibility. There are a gazillion things that can go
> wrong with LASIK, just like there are a gazillion things that can kill
> you every day. It is the probability that is more important to
> reasonable people than just the possibility.
>
> The most you can expect from LASIK is the convenience of a reduced
> need for corrective lenses. To achieve that convenience, you will
> need to accept some risk.
>
> If after evaluation by a competent doctor you are uncomfortable with
> your individual probabilities, then simply don't have surgery. This
> is an elective procedure and nobody is forcing you to go under the
> laser.
>
> If you have not already, please visit our websites and take a look at
> the information there. Hopefully it will help you make an informed
> decision.
>
> Glenn Hagele
> Executive Director
> USAEyes.org
>
> "Consider and Choose With Confidence"
>
> Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
>
> http://www.USAEyes.org
> http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
>
> I am not a doctor.
| |
| Glenn - USAEyes.org 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| I was not alluding to any patient. My information is general in
nature and applies to all persons considering LASIK or similar
refractive surgery.
It is true I wear glasses and occasionally contacts. It has been
determined in the past that I am a poor candidate for refractive
surgery. Anyone who is evaluated to be a poor candidate should not
have refractive surgery.
Glenn Hagele
Executive Director
USAEyes.org
"Consider and Choose With Confidence"
Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
http://www.USAEyes.org
http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
I am not a doctor.
| |
| Glenn - USAEyes.org 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| The cornea does heal, but not in the same way a cut on your arm would
heal. For details about LASIK and IntraLASIK flap healing, visit
http://www.usaeyes.org/faq/subjects/complete.htm
Unlike nerves in some other parts of the body, corneal nerves do heal.
This is important because corneal nerve sensitivity is an important
part of tear production and without sensitivity, temporary dry eyes is
likely to occur. Sensitivity usually returns within the 1-6 month
normal healing period. A small (but important) percentage of people
have LASIK induced dry eye problems after six months. Corneal nerve
density returns to preoperative levels in about two years for PRK and
its cousins LASEK and Epi-LASIK, but not until about five years for
LASIK and IntraLASIK. Of course, the sensitivity is what is most
important, not density.
For more on dry eye prevention and refractive surgery, visit
http://www.usaeyes.org/faq/subjects/dry_eyes.htm
All surgery has risk. There is no such thing as a perfect surgical
procedure or perfect surgeon. If you are not willing to accept the
risk, no matter how small, and/or if you are unable to accept
compromised vision during healing, then do not have refractive
surgery.
Glenn Hagele
Executive Director
USAEyes.org
"Consider and Choose With Confidence"
Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
http://www.USAEyes.org
http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
I am not a doctor.
| |
| Informer 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Glenn, the density reflects the number of nerves that are still 'alive'
after the procedure. Loss of corneal nerve density means nerve loss. Studies
have demonstrated significant and progressive nerve loss. Young patients not
usually considered to be at risk for dry eye are developing dry eye several
years AFTER their LASIK.
LASIK causes permanent nerve damage to all patients who undergo the
procedure. No patient in any study who was examined by a technique capable
of measuring nerve loss was found to have normal nerve density.
Stop selling a procedure that hurts people, and stop referring people to
your own jaded pro-LASIK pimp website. You push propaganda for personal
profit at the expense of visual health of the public. Shame on you.
"Glenn - USAEyes.org" <glenn.hageleSTOPSPAM@USAEyes.org> wrote in message
news:r62b819n9ee3mslafd7464r8sk18a3qa2r@4ax.com...
> The cornea does heal, but not in the same way a cut on your arm would
> heal. For details about LASIK and IntraLASIK flap healing, visit
> http://www.usaeyes.org/faq/subjects/complete.htm
>
> Unlike nerves in some other parts of the body, corneal nerves do heal.
> This is important because corneal nerve sensitivity is an important
> part of tear production and without sensitivity, temporary dry eyes is
> likely to occur. Sensitivity usually returns within the 1-6 month
> normal healing period. A small (but important) percentage of people
> have LASIK induced dry eye problems after six months. Corneal nerve
> density returns to preoperative levels in about two years for PRK and
> its cousins LASEK and Epi-LASIK, but not until about five years for
> LASIK and IntraLASIK. Of course, the sensitivity is what is most
> important, not density.
>
> For more on dry eye prevention and refractive surgery, visit
> http://www.usaeyes.org/faq/subjects/dry_eyes.htm
>
> All surgery has risk. There is no such thing as a perfect surgical
> procedure or perfect surgeon. If you are not willing to accept the
> risk, no matter how small, and/or if you are unable to accept
> compromised vision during healing, then do not have refractive
> surgery.
>
> Glenn Hagele
> Executive Director
> USAEyes.org
>
> "Consider and Choose With Confidence"
>
> Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
>
> http://www.USAEyes.org
> http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
>
> I am not a doctor.
| |
| Tabby 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| The cornea only heals a little bit around the edges. The underside of the
flap and the rest of the cornea have an unhealed 'split' called the
interface. You will always have
an interface after LASIK, and almost everybody's interface is full of JUNK
like bits of plastic, bits of metal from the microkeratome blade, etc.
"Glenn - USAEyes.org" <glenn.hageleSTOPSPAM@USAEyes.org> wrote in message
news:r62b819n9ee3mslafd7464r8sk18a3qa2r@4ax.com...
> The cornea does heal, but not in the same way a cut on your arm would
> heal. For details about LASIK and IntraLASIK flap healing, visit
> http://www.usaeyes.org/faq/subjects/complete.htm
>
> Unlike nerves in some other parts of the body, corneal nerves do heal.
> This is important because corneal nerve sensitivity is an important
> part of tear production and without sensitivity, temporary dry eyes is
> likely to occur. Sensitivity usually returns within the 1-6 month
> normal healing period. A small (but important) percentage of people
> have LASIK induced dry eye problems after six months. Corneal nerve
> density returns to preoperative levels in about two years for PRK and
> its cousins LASEK and Epi-LASIK, but not until about five years for
> LASIK and IntraLASIK. Of course, the sensitivity is what is most
> important, not density.
>
> For more on dry eye prevention and refractive surgery, visit
> http://www.usaeyes.org/faq/subjects/dry_eyes.htm
>
> All surgery has risk. There is no such thing as a perfect surgical
> procedure or perfect surgeon. If you are not willing to accept the
> risk, no matter how small, and/or if you are unable to accept
> compromised vision during healing, then do not have refractive
> surgery.
>
> Glenn Hagele
> Executive Director
> USAEyes.org
>
> "Consider and Choose With Confidence"
>
> Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
>
> http://www.USAEyes.org
> http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
>
> I am not a doctor.
| |
| Glenn - USAEyes.org 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| If the density was at preoperative levels and sensitivity was not,
density would make no difference at all to the patient's tearing
system. Equally, if the density is not at preoperative levels and
sensitivity is, then density makes no difference at all. Nerve
density is a viable measurement of recovery, but sensitivity is what
is important.
Yes, LASIK and all elective surgery caused permanent changes. Some
may choose to call that damage, others call it improvement.
I do not sell refractive surgery. I have never privately nor publicly
told anyone to have refractive surgery - although I have strongly
advised against it on several occasions. What I do is provide is
substantiated information. For some, that may indicate that
refractive surgery is appropriate. For others, that same information
may indicate it is not appropriate. This is a decision made by an
individual about their individual circumstances with the advice of a
(hopefully) competent doctor.
Glenn Hagele
Executive Director
USAEyes.org
"Consider and Choose With Confidence"
Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
http://www.USAEyes.org
http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
I am not a doctor.
| |
| Glenn - USAEyes.org 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Apparently Tabby did not bother to read the article referenced in my
previous post.
Glenn Hagele
Executive Director
USAEyes.org
"Consider and Choose With Confidence"
Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
http://www.USAEyes.org
http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
I am not a doctor.
| |
| serebel 2005-05-18, 11:46 am |
| Glenn was spot on here, the lunatic fringe comes out of the woodwork to
outright lie about a procedure that has done wonders for millions of
people.
SErebel
|
| |
|
|