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Home > Archive > Medicine laboratory > September 2006 > The neuroscience of Vital Points?
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The neuroscience of Vital Points?
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| Radium 2006-09-23, 9:32 pm |
| Hi:
I saw fight science on National Geographic about a week ago. There were
several pressure points that got me interested. The solar plexus and
the armpits. Apparently, a hard punch to those areas can cause the
victim to go into shock due to injury of the nerve plexi in those
regions. Something to do with calcium ions, IIRC.
Apparently a blow to the solar plexus or underarm plexi can shock the
victim even if he/she feels little or no pain.
A punch to the solar plexus can stop the heart by sending confusing
signals to the brain. The autonomic nervous system "thinks" the heart
is swelling and therefore tries to decrease the strength of the
heartbeat. In addition, a blow to the guts sends false respiratory
signals to the brain, tricking the autonomic nervous system into
beleiving that the lungs is filled with air.
Apparently the brain between your shoulders is not the only brain you
need to worry about. A blow to any nerve plexus [such as the abdominal
brain] can cause a fatal shock to the visercal nervous system.
Regards,
Radium
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| r norman 2006-09-24, 8:26 am |
| On 23 Sep 2006 19:03:06 -0700, "Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
>Hi:
>
>I saw fight science on National Geographic about a week ago. There were
>several pressure points that got me interested. The solar plexus and
>the armpits. Apparently, a hard punch to those areas can cause the
>victim to go into shock due to injury of the nerve plexi in those
>regions. Something to do with calcium ions, IIRC.
>
>Apparently a blow to the solar plexus or underarm plexi can shock the
>victim even if he/she feels little or no pain.
>
>A punch to the solar plexus can stop the heart by sending confusing
>signals to the brain. The autonomic nervous system "thinks" the heart
>is swelling and therefore tries to decrease the strength of the
>heartbeat. In addition, a blow to the guts sends false respiratory
>signals to the brain, tricking the autonomic nervous system into
>beleiving that the lungs is filled with air.
>
>Apparently the brain between your shoulders is not the only brain you
>need to worry about. A blow to any nerve plexus [such as the abdominal
>brain] can cause a fatal shock to the visercal nervous system.
>
Your obsession with neural factors that can cause death has long since
passed into the pathological. Please don't inflict this aberration on
all of us.
| |
| Radium 2006-09-24, 4:26 pm |
|
r norman wrote:
> On 23 Sep 2006 19:03:06 -0700, "Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
>
>
> Your obsession with neural factors that can cause death has long since
> passed into the pathological. Please don't inflict this aberration on
> all of us.
Its too interesting. I can't help it. Sorry. Anyways I am just in it
for the science. How an injury to a peripheral nerve network [such as
the nerve plexus in the upper leg] can have remarkable effects on
viserca for above the legs.
| |
| Jason Johnson 2006-09-24, 4:26 pm |
| In article <1159118322.135645.136630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
"Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
r norman wrote:
> On 23 Sep 2006 19:03:06 -0700, "Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
>
>
> Your obsession with neural factors that can cause death has long since
> passed into the pathological. Please don't inflict this aberration on
> all of us.
Its too interesting. I can't help it. Sorry. Anyways I am just in it
for the science. How an injury to a peripheral nerve network [such as
the nerve plexus in the upper leg] can have remarkable effects on
viserca for above the legs.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Your interest in this subject is not a problem unless it becomes an
obsession. You may want to google "obsession". I know someone that seems
to have an obsession with a professional football team. However, he keeps
his obsession under control and seems to have a great relationship with
his wife and children. Therefore, he may not even have a true obsession.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
| |
| r norman 2006-09-24, 4:26 pm |
| On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 11:57:52 -0700, jason@nospam.com (Jason Johnson)
wrote:
>In article <1159118322.135645.136630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
>"Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
>
> r norman wrote:
>
> Its too interesting. I can't help it. Sorry. Anyways I am just in it
> for the science. How an injury to a peripheral nerve network [such as
> the nerve plexus in the upper leg] can have remarkable effects on
> viserca for above the legs.
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>Your interest in this subject is not a problem unless it becomes an
>obsession. You may want to google "obsession". I know someone that seems
>to have an obsession with a professional football team. However, he keeps
>his obsession under control and seems to have a great relationship with
>his wife and children. Therefore, he may not even have a true obsession.
>Jason
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I did pick the wrong specific post to talk about an obsession that was
clearly evident in Radiums prior fixation on pain. The question of
pressure points, including whether or not they may actually exist, is
indeed a proper subject. It was the reference to shock that set me
off because that was the focus of the connection between pain and
death previously shown.
| |
| Jason Johnson 2006-09-24, 4:26 pm |
| In article <fhndh21l9f07ld3fg3qv6s6cesit8pevah@4ax.com>, r norman
<r_s_norman@_comcast.net> wrote:
On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 11:57:52 -0700, jason@nospam.com (Jason Johnson)
wrote:
>In article <1159118322.135645.136630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
>"Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote:
>
> r norman wrote:
>
> Its too interesting. I can't help it. Sorry. Anyways I am just in it
> for the science. How an injury to a peripheral nerve network [such as
> the nerve plexus in the upper leg] can have remarkable effects on
> viserca for above the legs.
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>Your interest in this subject is not a problem unless it becomes an
>obsession. You may want to google "obsession". I know someone that seems
>to have an obsession with a professional football team. However, he keeps
>his obsession under control and seems to have a great relationship with
>his wife and children. Therefore, he may not even have a true obsession.
>Jason
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I did pick the wrong specific post to talk about an obsession that was
clearly evident in Radiums prior fixation on pain. The question of
pressure points, including whether or not they may actually exist, is
indeed a proper subject. It was the reference to shock that set me
off because that was the focus of the connection between pain and
death previously shown.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Only an expert (eg psychologist) could determine whether or not a patient
has an obsession. Your guess may or may not be correct.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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| Topo Gigio 2006-09-24, 9:35 pm |
|
"Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1159118322.135645.136630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> How an injury to a peripheral nerve network [such as
> the nerve plexus in the upper leg] can have remarkable effects on
> viserca for above the legs.
What is a *viserca*?
| |
| Radium 2006-09-25, 2:34 am |
|
Topo Gigio wrote:
> "Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1159118322.135645.136630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> What is a *viserca*?
The "insides" such as the heart, stomach, intestines, lungs, etc.
| |
| JEDilworth 2006-09-25, 2:34 am |
| http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/viscera
It's spelled "viscera."
Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology
"Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1159157091.027790.290480@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> The "insides" such as the heart, stomach, intestines, lungs, etc.
>
| |
|
| "JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote
> http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/viscera
> It's spelled "viscera."
> Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
> Microbiology
Don't correct him in public-
he may soil himself in ecstasy.
c.
| |
| BlueBeard 2006-09-25, 2:34 am |
| Hello,
"Radium" <glucegen1@excite.com> wrote
> Apparently a blow to the solar plexus or underarm plexi can shock the
> victim even if he/she feels little or no pain.
True, there is the autonomic nervous system that makes the limbs move
quicker (after damage to them) than what the brain can process (just look at
any biology book with the picture of the guy stepping on the nail). Without
getting into any of the details ( some of these targets that you have
mentioned are *real* but the reactions you have stated are a bit over
overstated ) I can send you to a link that actually teaches this type of
fighting based on autonomic reactions and has a lot of info about it. The
site is a bit cheesy for my taste, but the actual system works and has been
used in real combat.
http://www.targetfocustraining.com/
hope this helps,
bb
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| Shuurai 2006-09-25, 4:27 pm |
|
Radium wrote:
> Hi:
>
> I saw fight science on National Geographic about a week ago. There were
> several pressure points that got me interested. The solar plexus and
> the armpits. Apparently, a hard punch to those areas can cause the
> victim to go into shock due to injury of the nerve plexi in those
> regions. Something to do with calcium ions, IIRC.
There is a profound difference between what "can" happen and what you
can reasonably expect to have happen.
> Apparently a blow to the solar plexus or underarm plexi can shock the
> victim even if he/she feels little or no pain.
Apparantly getting a papercut "can" result in a flesh-eating germ
infection.
> A punch to the solar plexus can stop the heart by sending confusing
> signals to the brain. The autonomic nervous system "thinks" the heart
> is swelling and therefore tries to decrease the strength of the
> heartbeat. In addition, a blow to the guts sends false respiratory
> signals to the brain, tricking the autonomic nervous system into
> beleiving that the lungs is filled with air.
The brain is so gullible.
> Apparently the brain between your shoulders is not the only brain you
> need to worry about. A blow to any nerve plexus [such as the abdominal
> brain] can cause a fatal shock to the visercal nervous system.
Again, the word "can" leaves a lot of room for error. Technically, if
you ran headfirst into a brick wall, all of the atoms that make up your
body "can" miss those in the wall, allowing you to pass right through.
But I'd recommend wearing a helmet if you intend to try.
| |
| Entertained by my own EIMC 2006-09-26, 4:30 pm |
| "Shuurai" <Shuurai11@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1159202831.786858.241010@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
>
> Radium wrote:
<snip>
>
> The brain is so gullible.
I agree.
In order to arrive at a least inept (or EPT) overview of how mainly
our brains (CNSs or Actention Selection Systems) evolved to be the central
and most instrumental cause of why we Behave the ways we do, we must
philosophically, theoretically, and by help of a tolerance principled
intellectual attitude, guard ourselves against our gullability.
[The capitalized "Behave" was meant to symbolize a meaning big enough to
*neither* exclude what we do think or don't think, *nor* exclude what we do
or don't feel.]
This way we (or some of us) may 'effectively philosophically/theoretically'
(or EPTly)prevent ourselves from being too fooled by our natural tendency [a
tendency evolved and learnt or "conditioned-in" (more often than not an
effect produced outside of our conscious awareness and control)] to be
"AEVASIVE".
AEVASIVE (is a by the acronym "MAD" inspired acronym that) refers to our
evolved means of adapting to concurrent environmental causes of inescapable
predicaments and, no less importantly, to the inert requirement that we
continue to deal with these no longer environmentally current but at the
time automatically "conditioned-in" predicaments - or ordeals that does/did
not merely trigger a with "habituation" most typically associated active
sensory "filtering" (attention/preoccupation - or "actention" - allowing
mechanism and principle of how our approximately modular actentions
transiently maintain a dominant status by a principle of "center/surround
excitation/inhibition" or, IOW, by an as if mutual inhibitory 'competition'
between functionally and adaptively incompatible actention modules) but that
caused neural stimulation to an extent up to and above the threshold for
triggering the endorphin (or opioid) mediated mechanism of endogenous
"repression" (i.e. neural activity the closes synaptic gates in neural paths
that would otherwise allow electrochemical information to flow to become
manifest as self-defeating pain/distress/flight-fight and states of
conscious awareness that would be likewise self-defeating by motivating such
focuses/paying of actention).
"Conditioned-in unconscious reverberations of stressors, effecting symptoms
(nevertheless)" can be seen as a class of dynamic memories or ditto neural
imprints that is definitly not inEPTly described as "caused by "synaptic
(and/or specific or selective) 'hibernation' imploring traumatizing (type)
situations (or by ditto stimulation or stressors).
>
>
> Again, the word "can" leaves a lot of room for error. Technically, if
> you ran headfirst into a brick wall, all of the atoms that make up your
> body "can" miss those in the wall, allowing you to pass right through.
> But I'd recommend wearing a helmet if you intend to try.
It is unfortunate that our heads and bodies are not made of neutrinos, since
this would allow us a far superior form of AEVASIVEness than the one that we
are actually
capable of. :-)
P
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| ordosclan@gmail.com 2006-09-28, 2:31 am |
| Uh... the autonomic nervous system RAISES heartbeat and blood
pressure.... Given this effect, the blow to the stomach would effect
the stomach meridian via the vagus nerve which is what counteracts the
effects of the ANS. Sounds like more bad/questionable science, another
notch on the belt for post-modernism. Hope no one notices that we use
the wrong smart sounding terminology we attached to a effect. It
doesnt work reliably enough to be scientific. This example that is.
You dont give someone x CC's of epi and hope it works. You do if the
hearts going bonkers. But if your normal, your going to feel it unless
your a hardhead or a meth addict. You put pads on someones chest,
placement crossing the heart, and the heart is beating, the heart
stops. If the heart is stopped, it starts. Maybe. Point is, they
know that x amount of juice crossing the heart will do something to a
normal functioning heart. Apply it again and it reverses the effect.
Dr's are not neurologists or neuroscientists nor scientists. I know a
few. Totally different arena. These guys like to BS people by trying
to sound smart. Average IQ for a dr. is what? 114? Genius level is
130 baseline. Mentally retarded is 85. Most criminally have 95 or
below. Thats not saying much. You ever hear of someone flunking
medical school? Pretty XXXXing impossible.
The solar plexus hurts because its not fully mylienated. Someone is
saying the sensation of a strike here confuses a unrelated part of the
nervous system to produce an effect contrary to its known function?
ordosclan@gmail.com
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