Medicine laboratory - Advice on career choice in clinical laboratory science?

Author

Advice on career choice in clinical laboratory science?

Suestonto@yahoo.com.tw

2005-01-27, 8:42 am

I have graduated from university with a degree of Biological Science.
I am considering a university based clinical laboratory science program
in Loma Linda University, California. The program is two years. I
will have to endure the financial burden. I can't take the short term
one year program because I didn't take the prerequisites classes in the
college. If I do take these classes now, it will still take two years
to complete. Do you think it is worth it to spend such an effort to
become a medical technologist?

I have heard many users from the field of medical technology
complaining about the decline in salary. They said the field is pretty
much dead because anyone with simple training can handle the ordinary
routine laboratory works. Some said that computer will eventually put
medical technologists out of work. I am worry if I do get a CLS
degree, it will be a waste of time and money because I won't get a
higher salary or a better job as the result.

Is CLS a pretty much dead end career with no opportunity of getting a
higher position? Is it better to persuade a master or a PHD degree and
work in industry than medical community?

Some of the posters from this forum seem to portrait CLS or Med Tech
field as a collapsing or a declining field. These posts were dated in
1997 to 1999. It maybe true in 1998, but how is the field in 2005? I
have heard some posters mentioned that after many CLS schools closed
from 1996 to 2000, there is a shortage of medical technologists. Does
the shortage actually make medical technologists more appreciated?
I think what I want to know is. Is getting into CLS worth my effort?

Robert

2005-01-27, 8:42 am

I think you have to want to become a CLS first and not the other way around.
If you like performing lab testing in a medical field then that is the place
for you. If you see CLS as only in terms of salary or gaining in position
then I don't think the field is for you.
I think you answered your own question when you asked is it worth all the
effort. It wasn't an effort but a goal in my case and then you put up with
all the bad stuff.
I advise you not to go into the field and seek your fortune elsewhere with
advanced degrees.
The state is making it easier to pass the state exam. The exam itself is not
easier but the cut-off is much more relaxed now with many more people
entering California as CLS.

<Suestonto@yahoo.com.tw> wrote in message
news:1106684737.917876.326200@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> I have graduated from university with a degree of Biological Science.
> I am considering a university based clinical laboratory science program
> in Loma Linda University, California. The program is two years. I
> will have to endure the financial burden. I can't take the short term
> one year program because I didn't take the prerequisites classes in the
> college. If I do take these classes now, it will still take two years
> to complete. Do you think it is worth it to spend such an effort to
> become a medical technologist?
>
> I have heard many users from the field of medical technology
> complaining about the decline in salary. They said the field is pretty
> much dead because anyone with simple training can handle the ordinary
> routine laboratory works. Some said that computer will eventually put
> medical technologists out of work. I am worry if I do get a CLS
> degree, it will be a waste of time and money because I won't get a
> higher salary or a better job as the result.
>
> Is CLS a pretty much dead end career with no opportunity of getting a
> higher position? Is it better to persuade a master or a PHD degree and
> work in industry than medical community?
>
> Some of the posters from this forum seem to portrait CLS or Med Tech
> field as a collapsing or a declining field. These posts were dated in
> 1997 to 1999. It maybe true in 1998, but how is the field in 2005? I
> have heard some posters mentioned that after many CLS schools closed
> from 1996 to 2000, there is a shortage of medical technologists. Does
> the shortage actually make medical technologists more appreciated?
> I think what I want to know is. Is getting into CLS worth my effort?
>

mpmorin

2005-04-05, 6:13 pm

FYI

there will always be hospitals(labs will be around until well after you die)
and there will always be pharmaceutical companies and industrial companies
that require MT education. Don't forget the biggest one: Crime Labs.
Better yet: genetics. These are all based on medical technologist
education.

I always watch CSI on TV if I can. they're always doing MT stuff.
<Suestonto@yahoo.com.tw> wrote in message
news:1106684737.917876.326200@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>I have graduated from university with a degree of Biological Science.
> I am considering a university based clinical laboratory science program
> in Loma Linda University, California. The program is two years. I
> will have to endure the financial burden. I can't take the short term
> one year program because I didn't take the prerequisites classes in the
> college. If I do take these classes now, it will still take two years
> to complete. Do you think it is worth it to spend such an effort to
> become a medical technologist?
>
> I have heard many users from the field of medical technology
> complaining about the decline in salary. They said the field is pretty
> much dead because anyone with simple training can handle the ordinary
> routine laboratory works. Some said that computer will eventually put
> medical technologists out of work. I am worry if I do get a CLS
> degree, it will be a waste of time and money because I won't get a
> higher salary or a better job as the result.
>
> Is CLS a pretty much dead end career with no opportunity of getting a
> higher position? Is it better to persuade a master or a PHD degree and
> work in industry than medical community?
>
> Some of the posters from this forum seem to portrait CLS or Med Tech
> field as a collapsing or a declining field. These posts were dated in
> 1997 to 1999. It maybe true in 1998, but how is the field in 2005? I
> have heard some posters mentioned that after many CLS schools closed
> from 1996 to 2000, there is a shortage of medical technologists. Does
> the shortage actually make medical technologists more appreciated?
> I think what I want to know is. Is getting into CLS worth my effort?
>

mpmorin

2005-04-08, 10:17 pm

JEDilworth

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

The average age of a typical MT in the US is around 50. Do the math -
when everyone begins retiring in 10-15 years, there will NOT be many
replacements. When supply goes down, salary goes up. If you get in the
field now, you are the management of the future. My manager just turned
60 years old. The Ph.D's in microbiology that I've worked with over the
years are all in their mid to late 60's now. Just think of all the
knowledge that's going to soon be walking out the door!

Molecular testing is wide open right now, as many people are not trained
in this. The direction of laboratories is heading that way. Get involved
in the molecular testing field and you will be in demand.

When the baby boomers hit 65-70 years of age, the volume of lab testing
is going to skyrocket. They are going to need people to handle all of
that.

Nothing says you have to stay in California when you're finished...

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology 31 years

"mpmorin" <mpmorin@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:x_h4e.15160$7b.3000@trndny05...
> Better yet: genetics. These are all based on medical technologist
> education.

Mike Collins

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

JEDilworth wrote:
> The average age of a typical MT in the US is around 50. Do the math -
> when everyone begins retiring in 10-15 years, there will NOT be many
> replacements. When supply goes down, salary goes up. If you get in the
> field now, you are the management of the future. My manager just
> turned 60 years old. The Ph.D's in microbiology that I've worked with
> over the years are all in their mid to late 60's now. Just think of
> all the knowledge that's going to soon be walking out the door!
>
> Molecular testing is wide open right now, as many people are not
> trained in this. The direction of laboratories is heading that way.
> Get involved in the molecular testing field and you will be in demand.
>
> When the baby boomers hit 65-70 years of age, the volume of lab
> testing is going to skyrocket. They are going to need people to
> handle all of that.
>
> Nothing says you have to stay in California when you're finished...
>
> Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
> Microbiology 31 years

But are they going to retire. Our minimum retirement age is going up from 60
to 65. I don't intend to retire at 65 unless I'm too ill to work.

--
Mike Collins
UK
Mike&heather-at-oakwellmount-dot-freeserve-dot-co-dot-uk

JEDilworth

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

I would be willing to hazard a guess and say, yes, people will retire.
Every lab I've worked in have a mostly female staff. If their husbands
retire, there's a good probability that they will also.

I don't get full social security until age 67 because of the year I was
born. Bush & Co. are trying to change it for the younger folks and raise
it even higher. I'm 56 now so I think I'm safe (but you never know). I
still think that enough techs will retire to have plenty of openings for
the few kids that are going into the field. Enrollments in MT schools
now are back to what they were in the 1950's, i.e. low. Many schools
went out of business in the 80's due to the change in reimbursements
from Medicare. This caused labs to become cost centers instead of
revenue centers, and hospitals looked to cut anything that didn't
generate revenue.

I think the big problem is that, to become an MT, the prerequisites
include having a B.S. in either Biology or Chemistry. This entails a
heavy science curriculum, including organic chemistry. Kids today tend
to want it easy and don't want to take this difficult of an
undergraduate curriculum without some guarantee of decent wages. I don't
blame them, but I do see light at the end of the tunnel.

My geographical area used to have 5-6 MT schools at local hospitals in
the 70's when I trained. Each of these schools cranked out anywhere from
4-12 students per year. I would venture to say that many of those
students, like myself, stayed in the area and are still working. There
is now only ONE hospital based school (the one where I currently work)
plus one university based program. Our school only takes four students
per year. I'm not sure how many the local university takes. We also had
an MLT school affiliated with our hospital (a two year technician
program). That closed its doors two years ago. They replaced it with
[can you believe this] a massage therapy program. What were they
thinking????

This is why there will be shortages in the USA for the forseeable
future. Everything here depends upon insurance/Medicare/Medicaid
[welfare] reimbursements, and all the insurance companies and the
government are constantly trying to find ways to cut reimbursements.
This causes large labs to get larger, and their smaller counterparts to
become smaller. We currently do the work for four hospital microbiology
labs - our own plus three others which no longer have microbiology
onsite because it was too expensive to keep running small departments.
Through a partnering of the hospitals, some of their techs now work at
our lab. Specimens are all shipped to us via numerous courier runs in
our metro area multiple times a day. Hospitals here are part of
"systems" now in larger cities. Freestanding hospitals without system
affiliation are getting harder to find locally. Many rural hospitals are
now affiliated with either our system or our competitor's (yes, there's
competition for patients here, too). The hospital I used to work for
closed its doors in 1996 due to reduced reimbursements and the fact that
we housed mostly Medicare and Medicaid patients and had very few regular
medical insurance patients. The costs were too high for the hospital to
stay open. This happened in just a twenty year period. I trained there
in the early 70's, when Medicare reimbursements were paid via
fee-for-service and not DRG (diagnosis-related-group; you get paid a
lump sum per diagnosis, not by the test). The hospital had 350 beds
then, added a huge wing, and was going fine until 1984, when the bottom
fell out, DRG's were instituted, and the hospital slowly died over a
twelve year period.

A local independent lab (not hospital affiliated) kept its wages so low
that they finally couldn't attract anyone for interviews. Techs were
leaving when hospitals advertised openings because the wages were much
higher. They finally threw in the towel in January and raised their
techs' wages by $7/hour! That's an astronomical wage increase. That's
why I believe that wages must increase eventually when the supply
dwindles because if wages don't increase, there really will be no one to
do the work.

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology

"Mike Collins" <mike&heather@acornwellmount.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in
message news:d39av0$2ca$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> But are they going to retire. Our minimum retirement age is going up
from 60
> to 65. I don't intend to retire at 65 unless I'm too ill to work.

Manky Badger

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

"JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote in message
news:d6WdnU3YGfiaOMXfRVn-1w@buckeye-express.com...

> This is why there will be shortages in the USA for the forseeable
> future.

> A local independent lab (not hospital affiliated) kept its wages so low
> that they finally couldn't attract anyone for interviews. Techs were
> leaving when hospitals advertised openings because the wages were much
> higher. They finally threw in the towel in January and raised their
> techs' wages by $7/hour! That's an astronomical wage increase. That's
> why I believe that wages must increase eventually when the supply
> dwindles because if wages don't increase, there really will be no one to
> do the work.

[vbcol=seagreen]
> "Mike Collins" <mike&heather@acornwellmount.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in
> message news:d39av0$2ca$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> from 60

This is the difference between the US & the UK.
Over here in the UK we have this daft mindset that leaves us carrying on
working for peanuts.

I honestly believe that were UK path lab wages reduced to zero, a sizeable
proportion of lab people would find some other form of income, but still
keep doing the blood tests on a voluntary basis.
Am I wrong ?
How many unpaid hours do YOU work each week ?

Mike Collins

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

Manky Badger wrote:

> This is the difference between the US & the UK.
> Over here in the UK we have this daft mindset that leaves us
> carrying on working for peanuts.
>
> I honestly believe that were UK path lab wages reduced to zero, a
> sizeable proportion of lab people would find some other form of
> income, but still keep doing the blood tests on a voluntary basis.
> Am I wrong ?
> How many unpaid hours do YOU work each week ?

Quite a few. I bet you do too. However I'm living in hospital accomodation
at the moment and it's easy to get back to the lab, As for retiring if we
are paid peanuts then we retire on half a peanut.
I enjoy my work and don't want to give it up.

--
Mike Collins
UK
Mike&heather-at-oakwellmount-dot-freeserve-dot-co-dot-uk

Manky Badger

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

"Mike Collins" <mike&heather@acornwellmount.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in
message news:d3bsbb$e0r$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Manky Badger wrote:
>
>
> Quite a few. I bet you do too.

Oh yes - I'm in an hour early every day.
I wonder if our more captialistic cousins do ?

>However I'm living in hospital accomodation
> at the moment and it's easy to get back to the lab, As for retiring if we
> are paid peanuts then we retire on half a peanut.
> I enjoy my work and don't want to give it up.

I for one would go tomorrow if I could :o)

John Gentile

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

in article d3aslv$kvc$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk, Manky Badger at
spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk wrote on 4/10/05 5:46 AM:

>
> I honestly believe that were UK path lab wages reduced to zero, a sizeable
> proportion of lab people would find some other form of income, but still
> keep doing the blood tests on a voluntary basis.
> Am I wrong ?
> How many unpaid hours do YOU work each week ?

I also see a mindset that no matter how short staffed we are the work gets
done - usually by unpaid hours. As long as we keep performing the impossible
hospital admin will never believe us about shortages.

--
John Gentile Editor, Rhode Island Apple Group
yjgent@cox.net RIAG Web page: www.wbwip.com/riag/
"I never make mistakes, I only have unexpected learning opportunities!"

mpmorin

2005-04-11, 6:07 pm

JEDilworth

2005-04-12, 11:42 am

Mike Collins

2005-04-12, 11:42 am

Manky Badger

2005-04-12, 11:42 am

Mike Collins

2005-04-13, 4:40 pm

JEDilworth

2005-04-13, 4:40 pm

furtig

2005-04-19, 10:44 am

Bingo (I agree). No respect and no bucks. For lab week, I want a cake in
the shape of the H.M.S. Titanic. (I think we are getting "Team Work" buttons
and we have been ask to bake our own cake.) You want to sign on for the
maiden cruise take your own life boat. Just like the army you can plan to
be a team of one. Compared to Nursing. Admins have no problem paying for
traveling temps, or paying OT in nursing (but not for MTs). Part of the
problem is that inspectors can not, or do not directly site for staffing.
As a fellow peer inspector told me: "Don't XXXXX to me about staffing I
have just as bad...live with it". Quality and quantity of staffing has hit
bottom. We had two new techs quit when they realized how bad 11-7 was,
and that it would probably be 10 years + before they got to day light.
?Technology is dominated by those who manage what they do not understand.
------------------------
?"Vegetarian -- that's an old Native American word meaning lousy
hunter." ---attributed to Andy Rooney

"John Gentile" <yjgent@cox.net> wrote in message
news:BE7F30F2.18B20%yjgent@cox.net...
> in article d3aslv$kvc$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk, Manky Badger at
> spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk wrote on 4/10/05 5:46 AM:
>
sizeable[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> I also see a mindset that no matter how short staffed we are the work gets
> done - usually by unpaid hours. As long as we keep performing the
impossible
> hospital admin will never believe us about shortages.
>
> --
> John Gentile Editor, Rhode Island Apple Group
> yjgent@cox.net RIAG Web page: www.wbwip.com/riag/
> "I never make mistakes, I only have unexpected learning opportunities!"
>
>
>

JEDilworth

2005-04-19, 10:44 am

I am very lucky in that I don't work any unpaid hours, and I really
don't know anyone at our lab that works off the clock. I can't speak for
management, but the techs surely don't. How does that occur? I've worked
at two other hospitals and a private lab over the years, and was never
asked to work off the clock. Isn't that technically illegal? Walmart got
in big trouble for that recently.

We just got a bonus, also (third or fourth in 5 years - never had that
at former employers). Sounds as if we're the exception. However, the
workload is amazingly heavy, and we do work short some evenings. One of
our second shift techs is due to have her baby any minute, and I don't
think they're going to cover her hours with anything other than spotty
contingent hours for three months. That coupled with vacations, plus a
part time 24 hour/week position that is still unfilled leaves us working
pretty short. Again, they'd rather pay the overtime than the benefits.
They're paying out OT at time and a half, even! I just don't understand.
We do not get the luxury of taking a month off at a time over here,
either. A week at a time is the norm, although our place grants two
weeks sometimes. Because most of the techs have worked here forever they
have tons of vacation time to use up, and everyone just cannot take it
at the same time, so it must be rotated.

The hospital across the street is unionized, meaning the nurses, mostly
(union is UAW - yes, the United Auto Workers are branching out into
health care. We're also a big union city with lots of auto workers).
There was a push to unionize the lab three years ago but the vote was
about 60+ against/20+ for, and it hasn't been mentioned again.
Administration made it very clear that if the union were voted in,
schedules would have to be followed to the letter with no trades or
negotiations. This just wouldn't work with kids and doc's appointments,
etc., as we're mostly female, and our place is really flexible in
crises, so I think that's the main reason it was defeated. Most of the
people pro-union were male and on the day shift in chemistry/hematology.
However, I will admit we do benefit from a lot of their negotiations.

I can't imagine a hospital over here providing housing. That is pretty
much unheard of in the US.

The hospital administrators won't wake up until everyone starts to
retire. Yes, I believe that will really happen. I don't see people
working into their 70's here, although we may have to in the long run. I
have a bunch of high school friends who got their teaching degrees and
just retired on full pensions (30 years and out) and they're only 55.
They have a whole life ahead of them. They can either sit back and relax
or start another career. I feel like I'm one of the few that is still
working, although I know that's not the case. There is a lot of peer
pressure over here to retire early or by 65. People have been working
their butts off their whole lives and they've had it.

Oh well, it's my day off, so I'm going to stop typing and try to enjoy
what's left of it.

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology

"John Gentile" <yjgent@cox.net> wrote in message
news:BE7F30F2.18B20%yjgent@cox.net...
work gets[vbcol=seagreen]
> done - usually by unpaid hours. As long as we keep performing the
impossible
> hospital admin will never believe us about shortages.

Shylirin

2005-04-19, 10:44 am

I agree with what Judy has laid out here. It is against policy as well as
illegal for us to work off the clock. In our case, not only the extremely
heavy workload but also the horrible benefits package causes a large amount
of turnover. Since we are a medium sized lab anyway, even one person gone
on vacation causes staffing snafus that just have to be worked through.
Once I had to work every single day for 32 days, weekends included. I'm
not complaining, I would have done the work regardless. It just hit home to
hear someone else voicing the same issues. I have almost three solid months
of vacation time built up, and it was 5 years before I was able to take a
full week of time off. It's just that busy, and the work somehow has to be
done regardless of the staffing situation. A unionization movement also
failed here, mostly just because no one wanted to bother with all of the
extra regulations from the union. I understand your feeling that everyone
else gets to retire while you keep plugging away... I think the same thing
every so often.

Shylirin
"JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote in message
news:nZudneyRLdYKkv3fRVn-vg@buckeye-express.com...
> I am very lucky in that I don't work any unpaid hours, and I really
> don't know anyone at our lab that works off the clock. I can't speak for
> management, but the techs surely don't. How does that occur? I've worked
> at two other hospitals and a private lab over the years, and was never
> asked to work off the clock. Isn't that technically illegal? Walmart got
> in big trouble for that recently.
>
> We just got a bonus, also (third or fourth in 5 years - never had that
> at former employers). Sounds as if we're the exception. However, the
> workload is amazingly heavy, and we do work short some evenings. One of
> our second shift techs is due to have her baby any minute, and I don't
> think they're going to cover her hours with anything other than spotty
> contingent hours for three months. That coupled with vacations, plus a
> part time 24 hour/week position that is still unfilled leaves us working
> pretty short. Again, they'd rather pay the overtime than the benefits.
> They're paying out OT at time and a half, even! I just don't understand.
> We do not get the luxury of taking a month off at a time over here,
> either. A week at a time is the norm, although our place grants two
> weeks sometimes. Because most of the techs have worked here forever they
> have tons of vacation time to use up, and everyone just cannot take it
> at the same time, so it must be rotated.
>
> The hospital across the street is unionized, meaning the nurses, mostly
> (union is UAW - yes, the United Auto Workers are branching out into
> health care. We're also a big union city with lots of auto workers).
> There was a push to unionize the lab three years ago but the vote was
> about 60+ against/20+ for, and it hasn't been mentioned again.
> Administration made it very clear that if the union were voted in,
> schedules would have to be followed to the letter with no trades or
> negotiations. This just wouldn't work with kids and doc's appointments,
> etc., as we're mostly female, and our place is really flexible in
> crises, so I think that's the main reason it was defeated. Most of the
> people pro-union were male and on the day shift in chemistry/hematology.
> However, I will admit we do benefit from a lot of their negotiations.
>
> I can't imagine a hospital over here providing housing. That is pretty
> much unheard of in the US.
>
> The hospital administrators won't wake up until everyone starts to
> retire. Yes, I believe that will really happen. I don't see people
> working into their 70's here, although we may have to in the long run. I
> have a bunch of high school friends who got their teaching degrees and
> just retired on full pensions (30 years and out) and they're only 55.
> They have a whole life ahead of them. They can either sit back and relax
> or start another career. I feel like I'm one of the few that is still
> working, although I know that's not the case. There is a lot of peer
> pressure over here to retire early or by 65. People have been working
> their butts off their whole lives and they've had it.
>
> Oh well, it's my day off, so I'm going to stop typing and try to enjoy
> what's left of it.
>
> Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
> Microbiology
>
> "John Gentile" <yjgent@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:BE7F30F2.18B20%yjgent@cox.net...
> work gets
> impossible
>

Mike Collins

2005-04-19, 10:44 am

JEDilworth wrote:[vbcol=seagreen]
> I am very lucky in that I don't work any unpaid hours, and I really
> don't know anyone at our lab that works off the clock. I can't speak
> for management, but the techs surely don't. How does that occur? I've
> worked at two other hospitals and a private lab over the years, and
> was never asked to work off the clock. Isn't that technically
> illegal? Walmart got in big trouble for that recently.
>
> We just got a bonus, also (third or fourth in 5 years - never had that
> at former employers). Sounds as if we're the exception. However, the
> workload is amazingly heavy, and we do work short some evenings. One
> of our second shift techs is due to have her baby any minute, and I
> don't think they're going to cover her hours with anything other than
> spotty contingent hours for three months. That coupled with
> vacations, plus a part time 24 hour/week position that is still
> unfilled leaves us working pretty short. Again, they'd rather pay the
> overtime than the benefits. They're paying out OT at time and a half,
> even! I just don't understand. We do not get the luxury of taking a
> month off at a time over here, either. A week at a time is the norm,
> although our place grants two weeks sometimes. Because most of the
> techs have worked here forever they have tons of vacation time to use
> up, and everyone just cannot take it at the same time, so it must be
> rotated.
>
> The hospital across the street is unionized, meaning the nurses,
> mostly (union is UAW - yes, the United Auto Workers are branching out
> into health care. We're also a big union city with lots of auto
> workers). There was a push to unionize the lab three years ago but
> the vote was about 60+ against/20+ for, and it hasn't been mentioned
> again. Administration made it very clear that if the union were voted
> in, schedules would have to be followed to the letter with no trades
> or negotiations. This just wouldn't work with kids and doc's
> appointments, etc., as we're mostly female, and our place is really
> flexible in crises, so I think that's the main reason it was
> defeated. Most of the people pro-union were male and on the day shift
> in chemistry/hematology. However, I will admit we do benefit from a
> lot of their negotiations.
>
> I can't imagine a hospital over here providing housing. That is pretty
> much unheard of in the US.
>
> The hospital administrators won't wake up until everyone starts to
> retire. Yes, I believe that will really happen. I don't see people
> working into their 70's here, although we may have to in the long
> run. I have a bunch of high school friends who got their teaching
> degrees and just retired on full pensions (30 years and out) and
> they're only 55. They have a whole life ahead of them. They can
> either sit back and relax or start another career. I feel like I'm
> one of the few that is still working, although I know that's not the
> case. There is a lot of peer pressure over here to retire early or by
> 65. People have been working their butts off their whole lives and
> they've had it.
>
> Oh well, it's my day off, so I'm going to stop typing and try to enjoy
> what's left of it.
>
> Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
> Microbiology
>
> "John Gentile" <yjgent@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:BE7F30F2.18B20%yjgent@cox.net...
> work gets

Judy I think you've got the wrong idea about this extra hours business.
Nobody's asked to work unpaid overtime but often they just pitch in and help
when it gets busy. As a chief I'm not paid overtime and I'm not allowed to
work shifts. I often do paperwork after the working day because there are no
interruptions.
We offer extra overtime when needed but it's usually difficult to get many
volunteers.
The evening and night shift have a hard time because more than half of our
work comes from GPs and doesn't arrive until late afternoon. Last week one
of our night shift staff analysed more than 1000 samples between 9pm and
8am. A new record. Most of these were GP samples.
Shift staff in UK labs almost always work in the day as well. There are
very few who work nights only.

I live in hospital accomodation because I moved to a new job and haven't
bought a house in the area yet. It's not cheap, I pay 300 pounds per month
(over 550 dollars for one room and a shared kitchen) but it's convenient
because it's on the hospital site.
I should write more but I've got to drive 170 miles to work.

--
Mike Collins
UK
Mike&heather-at-oakwellmount-dot-freeserve-dot-co-dot-uk

Katra

2005-04-20, 8:53 am

In article <d3uch4$23j$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"Mike Collins" <mike&heather@acornwellmount.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> JEDilworth wrote:
>
> Judy I think you've got the wrong idea about this extra hours business.
> Nobody's asked to work unpaid overtime but often they just pitch in and help
> when it gets busy. As a chief I'm not paid overtime and I'm not allowed to
> work shifts. I often do paperwork after the working day because there are no
> interruptions.
> We offer extra overtime when needed but it's usually difficult to get many
> volunteers.
> The evening and night shift have a hard time because more than half of our
> work comes from GPs and doesn't arrive until late afternoon. Last week one
> of our night shift staff analysed more than 1000 samples between 9pm and
> 8am. A new record. Most of these were GP samples.
> Shift staff in UK labs almost always work in the day as well. There are
> very few who work nights only.
>
> I live in hospital accomodation because I moved to a new job and haven't
> bought a house in the area yet. It's not cheap, I pay 300 pounds per month
> (over 550 dollars for one room and a shared kitchen) but it's convenient
> because it's on the hospital site.
> I should write more but I've got to drive 170 miles to work.

Keerist...
and our people here XXXXX over our workload. ;-)
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Katra

2005-04-20, 8:53 am

In article <BE7F30F2.18B20%yjgent@cox.net>,
John Gentile <yjgent@cox.net> wrote:

> in article d3aslv$kvc$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk, Manky Badger at
> spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk wrote on 4/10/05 5:46 AM:
>
>
> I also see a mindset that no matter how short staffed we are the work gets
> done - usually by unpaid hours. As long as we keep performing the impossible
> hospital admin will never believe us about shortages.

That's why you need to quit working unpaid hours...
Don't you have "on call" techs?

If there is a serious problem, we will call our manager and get
permission to put in justified overtime.

You just stated the obvious.
They will never see it if you keep doing it.

Loyalty is one thing, (me and my team members have it in spades) but
only you can allow yourself to be taken advantage of, while the BOD
makes 4 times the amount of money that you do, off the sweat off your
backs!!!!!!

Granted, I won't walk out in the middle of a stat crossmatch for someone
that is bleeding to death, but I won't clock out either!
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell--you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Katra

2005-04-20, 8:53 am

In article <3s2dnRFyoO5JosLfRVn-qA@adelphia.com>,
"furtig" <specialagent@adelphia.net> wrote:

> Bingo (I agree). No respect and no bucks. For lab week, I want a cake in
> the shape of the H.M.S. Titanic. (I think we are getting "Team Work" buttons
> and we have been ask to bake our own cake.) You want to sign on for the
> maiden cruise take your own life boat. Just like the army you can plan to
> be a team of one. Compared to Nursing. Admins have no problem paying for
> traveling temps, or paying OT in nursing (but not for MTs). Part of the
> problem is that inspectors can not, or do not directly site for staffing.
> As a fellow peer inspector told me: "Don't XXXXX to me about staffing I
> have just as bad...live with it". Quality and quantity of staffing has hit
> bottom. We had two new techs quit when they realized how bad 11-7 was,
> and that it would probably be 10 years + before they got to day light.
> ?Technology is dominated by those who manage what they do not understand.
> ------------------------
> ?"Vegetarian -- that's an old Native American word meaning lousy
> hunter." ---attributed to Andy Rooney

Damn I'm glad I joined this group tonight... ;-)
I feel better now.

I guess misery loves company??? <lol>

K. BS MT (ASCP) Hematology section supervisor for 12+ years...
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Katra

2005-04-20, 8:53 am

In article <nZudneyRLdYKkv3fRVn-vg@buckeye-express.com>,
"JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote:

> I am very lucky in that I don't work any unpaid hours, and I really
> don't know anyone at our lab that works off the clock. I can't speak for
> management, but the techs surely don't. How does that occur? I've worked
> at two other hospitals and a private lab over the years, and was never
> asked to work off the clock. Isn't that technically illegal? Walmart got
> in big trouble for that recently.
>
> We just got a bonus, also (third or fourth in 5 years - never had that
> at former employers). Sounds as if we're the exception. However, the
> workload is amazingly heavy, and we do work short some evenings. One of
> our second shift techs is due to have her baby any minute, and I don't
> think they're going to cover her hours with anything other than spotty
> contingent hours for three months. That coupled with vacations, plus a
> part time 24 hour/week position that is still unfilled leaves us working
> pretty short. Again, they'd rather pay the overtime than the benefits.
> They're paying out OT at time and a half, even! I just don't understand.
> We do not get the luxury of taking a month off at a time over here,
> either. A week at a time is the norm, although our place grants two
> weeks sometimes. Because most of the techs have worked here forever they
> have tons of vacation time to use up, and everyone just cannot take it
> at the same time, so it must be rotated.

What's a vacation?
I have to wheedle just to get a 3 day weekend!!!

I end up donating excess vacation time to team members in trouble rather
than see it go to waste. We are only allowed to accumulate 350 hours and
I get 10 hours per pay period now becuase I've been there so long!

18 years... <sigh> Hard to believe sometimes.

>
> The hospital across the street is unionized, meaning the nurses, mostly
> (union is UAW - yes, the United Auto Workers are branching out into
> health care. We're also a big union city with lots of auto workers).
> There was a push to unionize the lab three years ago but the vote was
> about 60+ against/20+ for, and it hasn't been mentioned again.

Heh. Even talk of unionizing would get you canned!
They'd hire agency techs if they had to before they would allow that!

> Administration made it very clear that if the union were voted in,
> schedules would have to be followed to the letter with no trades or
> negotiations. This just wouldn't work with kids and doc's appointments,
> etc., as we're mostly female, and our place is really flexible in
> crises, so I think that's the main reason it was defeated. Most of the
> people pro-union were male and on the day shift in chemistry/hematology.
> However, I will admit we do benefit from a lot of their negotiations.

Talk is cheap.

Hours are tight due to being short handed as the long dreaded tech
shortage is finally beginning to affect us. We are fortunate to have a
good loyal team, most of who have been there for over 10 years, so we
try to take care of each other in a crisis.

It would not be a problem if it were not for the restrictions on
overtime... All of us are willing to work it if it was allowed just to
cover for each other in times of need, or even for vacations!

That restriction tho' just makes things so much more difficult.

And it's totally unrealistic. I've thought about going directly to the
hospital admin. but that would probably be professional suicide.

>
> I can't imagine a hospital over here providing housing. That is pretty
> much unheard of in the US.

Unless you are an MD. ;-)
One that brings in exceptionally high revenue.

>
> The hospital administrators won't wake up until everyone starts to
> retire. Yes, I believe that will really happen. I don't see people
> working into their 70's here, although we may have to in the long run.

Not a chance in hell. We are allowed to retire at 60 but most folks hang
in until 65 for increased benefits.

That is what IRA's are for.

> I have a bunch of high school friends who got their teaching degrees and
> just retired on full pensions (30 years and out) and they're only 55.
> They have a whole life ahead of them. They can either sit back and relax
> or start another career. I feel like I'm one of the few that is still
> working, although I know that's not the case. There is a lot of peer
> pressure over here to retire early or by 65. People have been working
> their butts off their whole lives and they've had it.
>
> Oh well, it's my day off, so I'm going to stop typing and try to enjoy
> what's left of it.

Go fishing...

>
> Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
> Microbiology
>

Cheers!
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Katra

2005-04-20, 8:53 am

In article <Of_7e.249$w4.36168@sooner.brightok.net>,
"Shylirin" <shylirin1@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I agree with what Judy has laid out here. It is against policy as well as
> illegal for us to work off the clock. In our case, not only the extremely
> heavy workload but also the horrible benefits package causes a large amount
> of turnover. Since we are a medium sized lab anyway, even one person gone
> on vacation causes staffing snafus that just have to be worked through.
> Once I had to work every single day for 32 days, weekends included. I'm
> not complaining, I would have done the work regardless. It just hit home to
> hear someone else voicing the same issues. I have almost three solid months
> of vacation time built up, and it was 5 years before I was able to take a
> full week of time off. It's just that busy, and the work somehow has to be
> done regardless of the staffing situation. A unionization movement also
> failed here, mostly just because no one wanted to bother with all of the
> extra regulations from the union. I understand your feeling that everyone
> else gets to retire while you keep plugging away... I think the same thing
> every so often.
>
> Shylirin

We have great benefits!
That's one of the things that keeps me here.

Want to work in Texas? <lol>
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Manky Badger

2005-04-20, 5:55 pm

"Katra" <KatraMungBean@Centurytel.net> wrote in message
news:KatraMungBean-D52B4E.01275420042005@corp.supernews.com...
> In article <BE7F30F2.18B20%yjgent@cox.net>,

> Granted, I won't walk out in the middle of a stat crossmatch for someone
> that is bleeding to death, but I won't clock out either!

And therin lies the rub !!!!

I am paid until 5.12pm. If whatever I am doing takes me until 5.14pm or
5.16pm (or more likely 6pm) there is no "clock" to record my extra hours.

(OK, so I try to make sure that people get back any extra hours they work,
but what with the extra leave from A4C and extended on call recovery & rest
periods, we need between 20-25% of the workforce out of the lab to use up
the leave/recovery/rest time.)

JEDilworth

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

So what you're saying is that you're salaried, not hourly? You get the
same amount of pay in every check, regardless of hours worked? That
could only happen here under a "salaried" scenario. Most management
people are salaried, and techs are hourly. We get paid from when we
punch in until when we punch out. If it gets busy right before we're
ready to leave (like it did a couple of times within the last month
where a spinal fluid was brought in JUST when we were all walking out
the door) we stay and finish it, and there's never any problem with
something like that. Various places obviously have rules about OT (how
much is allowed and when, etc.), but it's illegal here to be an hourly
employee and work "off the clock." As I mentioned previously, Walmart
got in BIG trouble recently for this, and owe millions in back wages.

We clock in and out via the TACS system, where we use the telephone in
the department to punch in our social security number and a code
signifying in and out. There are other codes to record vacation, etc.
The supervisors have computer access to all our hours, and can make
reports to track OT, etc. with the system.

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology

"Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote in
message news:d46a19$90s$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...

> I am paid until 5.12pm. If whatever I am doing takes me until 5.14pm
or
> 5.16pm (or more likely 6pm) there is no "clock" to record my extra
hours.

Katra

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

In article <d46a19$90s$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote:

> "Katra" <KatraMungBean@Centurytel.net> wrote in message
> news:KatraMungBean-D52B4E.01275420042005@corp.supernews.com...
>
>
> And therin lies the rub !!!!
>
> I am paid until 5.12pm. If whatever I am doing takes me until 5.14pm or
> 5.16pm (or more likely 6pm) there is no "clock" to record my extra hours.

Ew! That's against the law in this state, unless you are a supervisor on
"Salary". We have a couple of those and it really sux. ;-P

>
> (OK, so I try to make sure that people get back any extra hours they work,
> but what with the extra leave from A4C and extended on call recovery & rest
> periods, we need between 20-25% of the workforce out of the lab to use up
> the leave/recovery/rest time.)

Comp. time? ;-)
Laugh a minute ain't it? (not)

So, are you short handed due to a lack of available new tech's like we
are, or are you short because they are too cheap to give you the FTE's
you need?

Just curious.

If I had it to do all over again, I'd go into radiology and specialize
in CT and/or MRI, or possibly ultra-sound. I've heard that pays a lot
better.

And it looks equally as interesting......
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

JEDilworth

2005-04-21, 11:50 am

I have a nephew who started in Radiology and now is working as an
assistant to the cardiac cath docs. Believe me, from what I've heard
about Radiology, it's no walk in the park, and my hourly wage was always
more than he was making. His back is permanently screwed up from all the
lifting. You also have to pay your dues in "regular" radiology before
you move up into the other areas. It's lots of hard difficult work and
the docs are always bitching because you're taking too long. Many days
it's just bodies piled up out in the hall waiting to be scanned (he
works at a busy medical school hospital).

Not for me - I'll take my specimens in cups any day!

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology

> If I had it to do all over again, I'd go into radiology and specialize
> in CT and/or MRI, or possibly ultra-sound. I've heard that pays a lot
> better.

Manky Badger

2005-04-21, 5:52 pm

"Katra" <KatraMungBean@Centurytel.net> wrote in message
news:KatraMungBean-A8AEBC.00144021042005@corp.supernews.com...
> In article <d46a19$90s$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> "Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote:
>
>
> Ew! That's against the law in this state, unless you are a supervisor on
> "Salary". We have a couple of those and it really sux. ;-P

I don't think there's a lab in the UK that has a "clock" - we're all
salaried.

>
> Comp. time? ;-)
> Laugh a minute ain't it? (not)
>
> So, are you short handed due to a lack of available new tech's like we
> are, or are you short because they are too cheap to give you the FTE's
> you need?
>
> Just curious.

I can't say it's because management won't employ staff - most UK labs have
vacancies. We just seem (nationally) unable to recruit & retain.
The last time we advertised there wasn't a single (suitable) applicant who
was a UK national.

> If I had it to do all over again, I'd go into radiology and specialize
> in CT and/or MRI, or possibly ultra-sound. I've heard that pays a lot
> better.
>
> And it looks equally as interesting......

I'd do banking !

Manky Badger

2005-04-21, 5:52 pm

"JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote in message
news:pfCdnbY9brOdrfrfRVn-sg@buckeye-express.com...
> So what you're saying is that you're salaried, not hourly? You get the
> same amount of pay in every check, regardless of hours worked? That
> could only happen here under a "salaried" scenario.

I think it's fair to say that most UK labs work this way.

Annie

2005-04-21, 5:52 pm

"Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote in message
news:d48oi5$dgt$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote in message
> news:pfCdnbY9brOdrfrfRVn-sg@buckeye-express.com...
>
> I think it's fair to say that most UK labs work this way.
>

I've got a job interview tomorrow for a Quality System Manager's post. Never
thought I'd leave lab work - but it was too good an opportunity to miss.

Annie

Manky Badger

2005-04-21, 5:52 pm

"Annie" <notonyournellyann1e_t@worldofntl.com> wrote in message
news:H3S9e.182$WW5.8@newsfe2-win.ntli.net...
>
> "Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote in
> message
> news:d48oi5$dgt$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
>
> I've got a job interview tomorrow for a Quality System Manager's post.
> Never
> thought I'd leave lab work - but it was too good an opportunity to miss.

Good luck !!

I tried for a Head BMS job a coule of weeks ago and was told I'm too young
!!

JEDilworth

2005-04-21, 5:52 pm

The reason you can't get anyone interested in these jobs is that the pay
sucks for how many hours you're putting in. I've always been paid an
hourly wage and I've been in the biz 31 years now. There was a brief
movement in Congress to change the overtime rules and I think it's dead
for now, as the law that was proposed would prevent OT pay for nursing
personnel. There's a huge shortage of nurses now, and hospitals couldn't
get anyone to cover nursing shifts without overtime. This law would have
applied to any technical people (i.e. lab/radiology) also. We can only
cross our fingers that the Repubs don't bring it up again.

Wages are going up here due to shortages in many parts of the country. I
daresay that there will be supply and demand pressure in the UK also
EVENTUALLY to increase wages (probably in about 25 years when everyone
on this list is long retired).

Is the movement in the UK to outsource lab work to India affecting you
directly? What's happening here is that smaller labs are becoming
satellites of larger "reference" labs in hospital "systems" to cut down
costs. I'm just guessing here, but I see your reference labs becoming
India! Your labs will be turned into STAT labs, and expensive testing
will be outsourced to the highest bidder.

That could help discourage young kids from going into lab work, also. If
the "good stuff" is going somewhere else, why go through all those
science courses just to do 80,000,000 urinalyses and sets of lytes in
your lifetime?

If I had it to do over again, I'd become an accountant. CPA's are in
HIGH demand in the US since the Enron debacle, and they pretty much can
pick and choose where they want to work. My daughter works in a bank and
the pay, at least at the lower end, is garbage. I have no idea what
people with big finance MBA's make, however.

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology

"Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote in
message news:d48og5$6oo$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...

> I don't think there's a lab in the UK that has a "clock" - we're all
> salaried.

Katra

2005-04-22, 8:51 am

In article <d48og5$6oo$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote:

> "Katra" <KatraMungBean@Centurytel.net> wrote in message
> news:KatraMungBean-A8AEBC.00144021042005@corp.supernews.com...
>
> I don't think there's a lab in the UK that has a "clock" - we're all
> salaried.

Do you think that is due to socialized medicine?
We don't have that here... yet. ;-)
I'm sure it will come eventually.

>
> I can't say it's because management won't employ staff - most UK labs have
> vacancies. We just seem (nationally) unable to recruit & retain.
> The last time we advertised there wasn't a single (suitable) applicant who
> was a UK national.

I think the shortage is world wide by now!
It's just beginning to really hit here.
Most of the training programs have shut down due to a lack of students.
Even our local one only graduates less than 10 per year when it used to
do at least 30!

I'm beginning to wonder what is going to happen. Giant automated labs
run by just a few people? Coulter has a few systems for the routine
stuff, but I know we will never be OUT of work. There is too much
esoteric/reference lab type stuff being ordered still.

It is a bit scary tho'.

>
>
> I'd do banking !

Ok. ;-)

And I plan to retire into jewelry design.
I need to learn proper soldering techniques first, or get more serious
about investigating precious metal clay...
There is FAR more money to be made in the bead and jewelry industry!

Interesting how much people are willing to pay to decorate themselves.
<lol>

I just have to learn a bit more, and enter some competitions.

>
>
>
>
>

--
K.

Sprout the Mung Bean to reply...

There is no need to change the world. All we have to do is toilet train the world and we'll never have to change it again. -- Swami Beyondanada

>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby Farm>,,<Katraatcenturyteldotnet>,,<

http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=0&userid=katra

Katra

2005-04-22, 8:51 am

In article <H3S9e.182$WW5.8@newsfe2-win.ntli.net>,
"Annie" <notonyournellyann1e_t@worldofntl.com> wrote:

> "Manky Badger" <spam@puritanDOTfreeserve.FULLSTOPcoSPOTuk> wrote in message
> news:d48oi5$dgt$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
>
> I've got a job interview tomorrow for a Quality System Manager's post. Never
> thought I'd leave lab work - but it was too good an opportunity to miss.
>
> Annie

>
>
>
>

Good luck! :-)
If I were to leave the lab, I'd have to find something that paid at
least $20.00 per hour or more....... That's what I'm making now, plus a
bit more for shift differential.

Again, anyone want to come to work in the Central Texas area?
We need people pretty bad, and it's a nice area to live.

Gas is only $2.15 per gallon here, at least so far.
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Katra

2005-04-22, 8:51 am

In article <x6SdnancL87ws_XfRVn-3A@buckeye-express.com>,
"JEDilworth" <bactitech@nospamhortonsbay.com> wrote:

> The reason you can't get anyone interested in these jobs is that the pay
> sucks for how many hours you're putting in. I've always been paid an
> hourly wage and I've been in the biz 31 years now. There was a brief
> movement in Congress to change the overtime rules and I think it's dead
> for now, as the law that was proposed would prevent OT pay for nursing
> personnel. There's a huge shortage of nurses now, and hospitals couldn't
> get anyone to cover nursing shifts without overtime. This law would have
> applied to any technical people (i.e. lab/radiology) also. We can only
> cross our fingers that the Repubs don't bring it up again.
>
> Wages are going up here due to shortages in many parts of the country. I
> daresay that there will be supply and demand pressure in the UK also
> EVENTUALLY to increase wages (probably in about 25 years when everyone
> on this list is long retired).
>
> Is the movement in the UK to outsource lab work to India affecting you
> directly? What's happening here is that smaller labs are becoming
> satellites of larger "reference" labs in hospital "systems" to cut down
> costs. I'm just guessing here, but I see your reference labs becoming
> India! Your labs will be turned into STAT labs, and expensive testing
> will be outsourced to the highest bidder.
>
> That could help discourage young kids from going into lab work, also. If
> the "good stuff" is going somewhere else, why go through all those
> science courses just to do 80,000,000 urinalyses and sets of lytes in
> your lifetime?
>
> If I had it to do over again, I'd become an accountant. CPA's are in
> HIGH demand in the US since the Enron debacle, and they pretty much can
> pick and choose where they want to work. My daughter works in a bank and
> the pay, at least at the lower end, is garbage. I have no idea what
> people with big finance MBA's make, however.
>
> Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
> Microbiology
>

We need another good Micro tech.
If you are interesting in living in paradise, (Texas hill country), send
me an e-mail and I'll pass you on to my boss. ;-)
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

slenon

2005-04-22, 8:51 am

>If I had it to do over again, I'd become an accountant.
>Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)

If I had the opportunity to talk to my younger self, I'd tell him to stay in
the military, to take the music scholarship I turned down, to go into
broadcast journalism, or any of a dozen other options that I ignored or
discarded.

Other than being out of the loop when I'm the patient, I don't miss it. I
dislike the direction of heatlthcare today, with cost more important to the
MBA mangagers than quality; continual, intentional understaffing, and
pharmaceutical companies knowingly pushing antibiotics that cause class wide
resistance.

On good days I go fishing. On days when I hurt too much I don't. But I
don't miss doing more and more testing in less and less time for income that
doesn't keep up with inflation and ever decreasing benefits. And I don't
miss covering for co-workers with incomplete work ethics, being penalize
with overtime for being male, or losing out on the best vacation time for a
fishing trip because the mothers with school age kids are deemed to need it
more than I.

--
Stev Lenon 91B20 '68-'69
When the dawn came up like thunder
slenon@tampabay.rr.com
http://web.tampabay.rr.com/stevglo/...page92kword.htm

Mike Collins

2005-04-22, 8:51 am

Katra wrote:

> I think the shortage is world wide by now!
> It's just beginning to really hit here.
> Most of the training programs have shut down due to a lack of
> students. Even our local one only graduates less than 10 per year
> when it used to do at least 30!
>
> I'm beginning to wonder what is going to happen. Giant automated labs
> run by just a few people? Coulter has a few systems for the routine
> stuff, but I know we will never be OUT of work. There is too much
> esoteric/reference lab type stuff being ordered still.
>
> It is a bit scary tho'.
>
>
> Ok. ;-)
>
> And I plan to retire into jewelry design.
> I need to learn proper soldering techniques first, or get more serious
> about investigating precious metal clay...
> There is FAR more money to be made in the bead and jewelry industry!
>
> Interesting how much people are willing to pay to decorate themselves.
> <lol>
>
> I just have to learn a bit more, and enter some competitions.
>
Katra
We are automated but not completely. The reason one of our senior BMSs did
over 1000 samples in a night is that he wanted to put our new track system
through it's paces and see just what could be done. Pre track one person
often did several hundred samples at night.
The track has made life less stressful in biochemistry automation but there
is still plenty of work to do.

It's hard to find qualified staff in East Anglia but we have a steady supply
of trainees most of whom have degrees in related subjects and have to top up
their qualifications to meet current standards. he problem in not finding
potential trainees but funding their courses.

Pay at the lower levels is due to improve a lot soon - particularly for
trainees.

We do pay overtime but seniors only get this at time and chiefs like me are
supposed to do it for free.

--
Mike Collins
UK
Mike&heather-at-oakwellmount-dot-freeserve-dot-co-dot-uk

Katra

2005-04-22, 5:51 pm

In article <B06ae.14678$_t3.1192@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>,
"slenon" <slenon@tampabay.invalid.rr.com> wrote:

>
> If I had the opportunity to talk to my younger self, I'd tell him to stay in
> the military, to take the music scholarship I turned down, to go into
> broadcast journalism, or any of a dozen other options that I ignored or
> discarded.
>
> Other than being out of the loop when I'm the patient, I don't miss it. I
> dislike the direction of heatlthcare today, with cost more important to the
> MBA mangagers than quality; continual, intentional understaffing, and
> pharmaceutical companies knowingly pushing antibiotics that cause class wide
> resistance.
>
> On good days I go fishing. On days when I hurt too much I don't. But I
> don't miss doing more and more testing in less and less time for income that
> doesn't keep up with inflation and ever decreasing benefits. And I don't
> miss covering for co-workers with incomplete work ethics, being penalize
> with overtime for being male, or losing out on the best vacation time for a
> fishing trip because the mothers with school age kids are deemed to need it
> more than I.

Beautiful post!
I think I may share this one with our boss...
It just shows that the sinking moral in our lab
is a world wide symptom. ;-)

They've been cutting OUR benefits as well due to decreased revenues, but
still increasing benefits for nursing staff.

Guess our contribution to the "team" is less valuable than theirs?

<sigh>
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Katra

2005-04-22, 5:51 pm

In article <d4asop$va2$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"Mike Collins" <mike&heather@acornwellmount.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> Katra
> We are automated but not completely. The reason one of our senior BMSs did
> over 1000 samples in a night is that he wanted to put our new track system
> through it's paces and see just what could be done. Pre track one person
> often did several hundred samples at night.
> The track has made life less stressful in biochemistry automation but there
> is still plenty of work to do.
>
> It's hard to find qualified staff in East Anglia but we have a steady supply
> of trainees most of whom have degrees in related subjects and have to top up
> their qualifications to meet current standards. he problem in not finding
> potential trainees but funding their courses.
>
> Pay at the lower levels is due to improve a lot soon - particularly for
> trainees.
>
> We do pay overtime but seniors only get this at time and chiefs like me are
> supposed to do it for free.

So what track system do you use and how does it work?
I've never seen one in person...
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

SHARI

2005-04-23, 5:51 pm

As a microbiologist in the field for 20+ years, I can attest to the
median age. But it also makes you wonder why so many people still in
the field. Perhaps job fulfillment. Maybe it's not the money, but if
you want more money, go into nursing. My opinion is a good nurse is
worth all she gets. However, they don't stay in the field as long for
the most part. Again, as it was mentioned by someone else, you have to
do what will keep you satisfied.

Katra

2005-04-23, 5:51 pm

In article <1114282774.342392.12930@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"SHARI" <panekattack@msn.com> wrote:

> As a microbiologist in the field for 20+ years, I can attest to the
> median age. But it also makes you wonder why so many people still in
> the field. Perhaps job fulfillment. Maybe it's not the money, but if
> you want more money, go into nursing. My opinion is a good nurse is
> worth all she gets. However, they don't stay in the field as long for
> the most part. Again, as it was mentioned by someone else, you have to
> do what will keep you satisfied.
>

I think I am still in it after 18 years because I DO find it fulfilling,
and at $21.00 per hour (plus shift differential) the compensation is
sufficient for my needs along with the little bit if extra money I earn
on ebay. ;-)

Yes, nursing WOULD pay more, but I have no desire whatsoever to be a
nurse. If I was just looking for more money, there are other fields that
pay even more.

I guess another reason that I stay is because I'm comfortable..... At my
age, routine is just that. Comfortable. I know my job, I know the
people, I have enough experience to handle crisis etc. ;-)

I can expand my home business over time so I have something to retire in
to.

Despite all the moaning and complaining, there are FAR worse jobs, and
worse places to work for! Early in my career I worked additional PRN
jobs so I know that where I work is not all that bad...... Some places
are pure hell! St. David's in Austin is a good example! When I worked
PRN there, I felt like a random number generator and was almost climbing
the walls after only 6 hours there! No wonder they have hire on bonuses
being offered there right now. <G> They'd have to offer me a LOT to work
there again......

Still, I'm a bit worried about the future with the decrease in
availability of qualified new lab people. It's going to get interesting
here pretty soon!

--
K.

Sprout the Mung Bean to reply...

There is no need to change the world. All we have to do is toilet train the world and we'll never have to change it again. -- Swami Beyondanada

>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby Farm>,,<Katraatcenturyteldotnet>,,<

http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=0&userid=katra

JEDilworth

2005-04-23, 10:50 pm

I think the reason people stay with microbiology is that it's the most
hands-on department left in the lab. The work is mentally stimulating,
and if you work in a large enough lab, there's always something
"interesting."

I think nursing appeals to a different personality type than the lab
does. We have quite a few family friends who are nurses, and their
interests are definitely more "people" oriented than mine. I'm not big
on the patient contact side of things, but that's what they like about
their jobs. I think this is why nurses have such a hard time with doing
QC on POC instruments like glucose meters, etc. because they just can't
get into the technical stuff. They depend on us to do it, and just would
rather not deal with all that stuff.

I agree - being a nurse takes a special kind of person (which I am not).
I am much more at home in the lab and would probably miss it if I worked
somewhere else. Five years ago I tried a CRA - clinical research
associate - position in the oncology department at our local medical
school. The job really should have been given to an RN, as it dealt with
becoming intimately acquainted with the patients' charts, because
information had to come off the charts for the different research
programs the oncology patients were enrolled in. I lasted a month. I
missed the lab; I hated the quiet of being in an office. The learning
curve was at least 2-3 years, and, lastly, the pay was bad. I could have
done it for the pay given if I had enjoyed it, but I felt like I was in
prison. A lab job offer came to me two weeks into the job, and I
interviewed and left. I've never done that before, but the job was just
"not me." I shudder internally everytime I think about that awful month.
I told them at the exit interview that they really needed to hire a
nurse for the position.

I'm curious to see how long all the micro people in our place hang out
before they retire. I'm about five years older than the core group of
day shifters at our lab. It will be interesting to see who leaves first.
Since I've only been there five years I'm on second shift three nights
a week, but I'm the "senior" person on our shift, and my team leader and
I have the most micro experience on 2nd. I don't plan on leaving the
shift for days (I hate to get up in the morning) so I'll probably have a
job for as many years as I can drag my butt into work. We do plate
reading on our shift also, so it does make it more interesting than just
setting up specimens.

I have a friend from grade school who is my age. She's an RN in Neonatal
ICU. She works three twelve hour shifts a week. She said when she turns
62 (6 more years) she's leaving. She said the stress about kills her
now. She said that nursing jobs are easy to come by and she could work
per diem at a nursing home or many other venues for extra money. She
said she's not sure if she can stand the stress of hovering over teeny
babies for even six more years. I think the lab is infinitely less
stressful than that.

Judy Dilworth, M.T. (ASCP)
Microbiology - 31 years

"SHARI" <panekattack@msn.com> wrote in message
news:1114282774.342392.12930@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> As a microbiologist in the field for 20+ years, I can attest to the
> median age.

Katra

2005-04-24, 8:53 am

Katra

2005-04-24, 8:53 am

Manky Badger

2005-04-24, 8:53 am

JEDilworth

2005-04-24, 8:53 am

Mike Collins

2005-04-25, 5:51 pm

We have a Thermo Life sciences track supplied by Ortho. We have 3
Vitros 950s and one 250 on the track and one 250 plus two Beckman DXis
off track.
The track is fairly basic (no centrifuge, aliquotter, decapper or
recapper) but it made life a lot less stressful. Pending logs are a lot
smaller and we can deal with samples much more easily on the late and
night shifts. Life will get difficult in October when we have to
dismantle the track while the lab is rebuilt.

We will have a more comprehensive automated system next year when we
re-equip.

You must be the same Katra who posted on ASW. I don't go there any
more.

Mike

Katra

2005-04-25, 5:51 pm

In article <1114449426.080218.63940@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
"Mike Collins" <michael.collins@nnuh.nhs.uk> wrote:

> We have a Thermo Life sciences track supplied by Ortho. We have 3
> Vitros 950s and one 250 on the track and one 250 plus two Beckman DXis
> off track.
> The track is fairly basic (no centrifuge, aliquotter, decapper or
> recapper) but it made life a lot less stressful. Pending logs are a lot
> smaller and we can deal with samples much more easily on the late and
> night shifts. Life will get difficult in October when we have to
> dismantle the track while the lab is rebuilt.

Heh. I can imagine...
I was in on our last lab move also. People came in over the weekend and
did some overtime to get stuff moved, and to keep all up and running.

Thanks for the input!
I'm sure a track is in my eventual future if things keep going the way
they are....

>
> We will have a more comprehensive automated system next year when we
> re-equip.
>
> You must be the same Katra who posted on ASW. I don't go there any
> more.
>
> Mike

Possible. There are several Katra's on the internet tho' and I don't
recognize that group in my current list either.
I mostly do gardening, cooking lists, and graphic art lists now. ;-)

Gotta have a good hobby.......

>
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain

Manky Badger

2005-04-26, 5:52 pm

Annie

2005-04-26, 5:52 pm

Sorry if this is slightly off-topic.... but I got the Quality Systems
Manager's post. I will be leaving labwork which I've been doing since I was
17 (via OND,HNC, Fellowship).

I thought it was pretty scary going from a routine bacti lab to a reference
unit doing molecular testing but this is a totally different ball game!

Annie :o)

ps - now that my hands wont be spending most of their days in latex
gloves.... I'm getting myself a set of nails!

Manky Badger

2005-04-26, 5:52 pm

"Annie" <notonyournellyann1e_t@worldofntl.com> wrote in message
news:Z7wbe.8962$vU4.6833@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> Sorry if this is slightly off-topic.... but I got the Quality Systems
> Manager's post. I will be leaving labwork which I've been doing since I
> was
> 17 (via OND,HNC, Fellowship).
>
> I thought it was pretty scary going from a routine bacti lab to a
> reference
> unit doing molecular testing but this is a totally different ball game!

Co