Multiple sclerosis support - Cognition / oxidative stress

Author

Cognition / oxidative stress

ironjustice@aol.com

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

Neurology. 2005 Apr 12;64(7):1152-6. Links

Evidence of increased oxidative damage in subjects with mild cognitive
impairment.

Keller JN, Schmitt FA, Scheff SW, Ding Q, Chen Q, Butterfield DA,
Markesbery WR.

Department of Anatomy, university of Kentucky, Lexington 40536-0230,
USA. Jnkell0@pop.uky.edu

OBJECTIVE: To determine if increased levels of oxidative damage are
present in the brains of persons with mild cognitive impairment (MCI),
a condition that often precedes Alzheimer disease (AD). METHODS: The
authors assessed the amount of protein carbonyls, thiobarbituric
acid-reactive substances (TBARS), and malondialdehyde in the superior
and middle temporal gyri (SMTG) and cerebellum of short postmortem
interval and longitudinally evaluated normal subjects and those with
MCI and early AD. RESULTS: Elevated levels of protein carbonyls
(approximately 25%), malondialdehyde (approximately 60%), and TBARS
(approximately 210%) were observed in the SMTG of individuals with MCI
and early AD vs normal control subjects. The elevation in TBARS was
associated with the numbers of neuritic but not diffuse plaques. Levels
of protein carbonyls increased as delayed verbal memory performance
declined. CONCLUSION: Oxidative damage occurs in the brain of subjects
with mild cognitive impairment, suggesting that oxidative damage may be
one of the earliest events in the onset and progression of Alzheimer
disease.

PMID: 15824339 [PubMed - in process]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://herbivore.7h.com

Joan Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On 17 Apr 2005 22:18:27 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com" <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote
in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>Evidence of increased oxidative damage in subjects with mild cognitive
>impairment.

Anyone know how to remove this thorn?
---
Joan

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

Joan Carter wrote:

> On 17 Apr 2005 22:18:27 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com" <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote
> in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
>
> Anyone know how to remove this thorn?

Joan, your're using Forte Agent.
According to someone else, select his post then:
Press 'Ctrl & K' at the same time, followed by 'I' (the letter I, not L)
According to the other person, that should block all his posts (under his current
email address) from your view for every newsgroup, but you'll still see his posts,
if others reply to him.

steve@tropheus.demon.co.uk

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:06:05 -0400, J <ware@anon.anon> wrote:

>but you'll still see his posts,
>if others reply to him.
>

No, that's what the 'I' is for. It is for "Ignore Thread" so all the
replies are ignored.

--
Steve Wolstenholme Neural Planner Software

EasyNN-plus. The easy way to build neural networks.
http://www.easynn.com

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

Joan Carter wrote:

> On 17 Apr 2005 22:18:27 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com"
> <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
>
> Anyone know how to remove this thorn?

Garlic, silver cross and wooden stake.

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

"Michael" <muirhead@haidagwaii.net> wrote in message
news:WZCdnezG8ZeUYv7fRVn-jA@qcislands.net...
> Joan Carter wrote:
>
>
> Garlic, silver cross and wooden stake.
>

Clearly, Tommy has a large thorn. The best way to tweeze it would be with a
posthole trencher.

CW

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

CW wrote:

> "Michael" <muirhead@haidagwaii.net> wrote in message
> news:WZCdnezG8ZeUYv7fRVn-jA@qcislands.net...
>
>
> Clearly, Tommy has a large thorn. The best way to tweeze it would be
> with a posthole trencher.
>
> CW

Or a grapple yarder. :-)

http://www.forestnet.com/archives/a...cs/grapple1.jpg

Paul T. Holland

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

i believe the story says 'a mouse' ???? i shall duck now....

Joan Carter wrote:

> On 17 Apr 2005 22:18:27 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com" <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote
> in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
>
> Anyone know how to remove this thorn?
> ---
> Joan

ironjustice@aol.com

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

Mult Scler. 2005 Apr;11(2):191-7. Related Articles, Links

Pattern of neuropsychological impairment in the early phase of
relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis.

Olivares T, Nieto A, Sanchez MP, Wollmann T, Hernandez MA, Barroso J.

Facultad de Psicologia, Universidad de La Laguna, La Laguna 38205,
Tenerife, Islas Canarias, Spain.

To investigate the neuropsychological profile in the first few years
post-onset of relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis (MS) we carried
out a comprehensive neuropsychological evaluation of 33 patients
characterized by very short evolution of this disease, minimal levels
of neurological disability and preserved general cognition.
Thirty-three individually pair-matched controls were also evaluated.
Patients performed as well as controls on many of the cognitive
exploration measures. Nevertheless, the group of patients evinced a
general slowness that affected motor execution and cognitive
processing. Memory functions were characterized by preservation of
working memory, retrieval or storage of information and a deficit at
the acquisition phase in (verbal and visual) supraspan tasks. In
addition, significant correlations were observed between some measures
of information processing speed and memory. These results highlight the
importance of studying cognitive deficits not only in the different
subtypes of MS but also in different phases of the disease.

PMID: 15794394 [PubMed - in process]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/manisaherbivore
DEADPEOPLE WALKING
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/deadpeoplewalking

Jim Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 10:28:34 -0400, Joan Carter
<spamfree@sentex.ca> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>On 17 Apr 2005 22:18:27 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com" <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote
>in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
>
>Anyone know how to remove this thorn?
>---
>Joan

Agent Orange.
--
Spelling and grammatical errors are deliberate
to catch copyright violators. ©¿©¬
Perth, Ontario, Canada

Jim Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

You are seeing this message because Tom Hennessy
aka ironjustice@aol.com has posted a message in
alt.support.mult-sclerosis. If you are new to this
group then please understand that he appears to get
his thrills from the misfortunes of other people,
evidenced by his comments to the victims of forest
fires, the passing of members of this newsgroup and
his presence on all support newsgroups.

In keeping with his personality, Tommy believes
discussions in these groups are conducted by
using off-colour language and name calling
that would make a rattlesnake spew. This personality
trait is shown here:

http://flyembie.notlong.com

He seems to believe that whoever swears loudest and
longest is the winner.

In his mind, Hennessy believes he is a great
researcher who has won a Nobel Prize. In fact, he
merely copies medical material from the web and
pastes it to usenet, proudly calling this his research.

There was a time when people like Tommy were
institutionalized, now they are allowed to run for
public office and post to usenet. He is a fine
example why a mental health unit should not
obtain an internet account.

Previous addresses include watchman@nucleus.com,
thennessy@telus.net, darreltaylor911@hotmail.com.
--
Spelling and grammatical errors are deliberate
to catch copyright violators. ©¿©¬
Perth, Ontario, Canada

Jim Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On 18 Apr 2005 17:51:01 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com"
<ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>Mult Scler. 2005 Apr;11(2):191-7. Related Articles, Links

Most other groups must be wondering why the goofboy is sending an
exclusively MS message to them. On second thought, regulars will
just ignore you and newbies will be given their first taste of
what a nutcase you are. Keep up the good work!
--
Spelling and grammatical errors are deliberate
to catch copyright violators. ©¿©¬
Perth, Ontario, Canada

ironjustice@aol.com

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

Have you something to .. say .. about .. cognition and oxidative stress
... ?

How about .. cognition .. ?

Keep it on topic and keep your personal comments to yourself ..

Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/manisaherbivore
DEADPEOPLE WALKING
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/deadpeoplewalking

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

There's no mention whatsoever of oxidative stress here, Tom.

If you're hallucinating again, you must have forgotten your meds.

ironjustice@aol.com wrote:

> Mult Scler. 2005 Apr;11(2):191-7. Related Articles, Links
>
>
> Pattern of neuropsychological impairment in the early phase of
> relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis.
>
> Olivares T, Nieto A, Sanchez MP, Wollmann T, Hernandez MA, Barroso J.
>
> Facultad de Psicologia, Universidad de La Laguna, La Laguna 38205,
> Tenerife, Islas Canarias, Spain.
>
> To investigate the neuropsychological profile in the first few years
> post-onset of relapsing-remitting multiple sclerosis (MS) we carried
> out a comprehensive neuropsychological evaluation of 33 patients
> characterized by very short evolution of this disease, minimal levels
> of neurological disability and preserved general cognition.
> Thirty-three individually pair-matched controls were also evaluated.
> Patients performed as well as controls on many of the cognitive
> exploration measures. Nevertheless, the group of patients evinced a
> general slowness that affected motor execution and cognitive
> processing. Memory functions were characterized by preservation of
> working memory, retrieval or storage of information and a deficit at
> the acquisition phase in (verbal and visual) supraspan tasks. In
> addition, significant correlations were observed between some measures
> of information processing speed and memory. These results highlight
> the importance of studying cognitive deficits not only in the
> different
> subtypes of MS but also in different phases of the disease.
>
> PMID: 15794394 [PubMed - in process]
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Who loves ya.
> Tom
> Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
> http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
> Man Is A Herbivore!
> http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/manisaherbivore
> DEADPEOPLE WALKING
> http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/deadpeoplewalking

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

ironjustice@aol.com wrote:

> Have you something to .. say .. about .. cognition and oxidative
> stress .. ?

Does the abstract say anything about either of them?

No. It says (and this has been known for a long time) that people with MS
can have - often very subtle - cognitive changes.

> How about .. cognition .. ?

You mean, like awareness that the abstract you posted doesn't match the
subject header you gave it?

> Keep it on topic and keep your personal comments to yourself ..

Keep it within the bounds of reality and keep your hallucinations to
yourself.

ironjustice@aol.com

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

listen up you creepy fk ..

The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..

So you UNDERSTAND ....The thread is .. cognition ..?

So since .. group members HAVE SPECIFICALLY STATED COGNITION ARTICLES
ARE .. welcomed .. YOU .. fk off ..

Dig .. jrkff .. ?

Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/manisaherbivore
DEADPEOPLE WALKING
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/deadpeoplewalking

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

ironjustice@aol.com wrote:

> listen up you creepy fk ..

Who, me?

Shows what *you* know, Tom.

THIS is a creepy fk:

http://www.uglypeople.com/uploaded/66826/dave2.jpg

> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
>
> So you UNDERSTAND ....The thread is .. cognition ..?

The thread you began is about cognition as it's related (in your fevered
imagination, at least) to oxidative stress... and in case you have memory
trouble (that's a cognitive deficit, BTW) you should refer to the first post
in this thread:
Message-ID: <1113801507.453419.64710@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>

> So since .. group members HAVE SPECIFICALLY STATED COGNITION ARTICLES
> ARE .. welcomed .. YOU .. fk off ..

The fact that you finally posted something about MS (even if it *is* just a
regurgitation of well-known ancient history by some unfortunate grad
students who were desperate for something to publish,) doesn't automatically
entitle you to respect, Tom.

> Dig .. jrkff .. ?

Seriously, Tom... "jrkff"?

Learn to say what you mean in plain language, would you, please? Stop
hiding your words like some immature, sniggering, half-defiant and
half-ashamed schoolboy.

Jim Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On 18 Apr 2005 19:44:05 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com"
<ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>Have you something to .. say .. about .. cognition and oxidative stress
>.. ?
>
>How about .. cognition .. ?

Not until you mentioned it.

Oxidative stress is a factor in most diseases. Why do you keep
bringing it up? Are you forgetful?

And why is the only symptom of MS that you mention is cognition.
Do you have a simpleton's mind?
--
Spelling and grammatical errors are deliberate
to catch copyright violators. ©¿©¬
Perth, Ontario, Canada

Jim Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On 18 Apr 2005 20:03:38 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com"
<ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>So since .. group members HAVE SPECIFICALLY STATED COGNITION ARTICLES
>ARE ..

Show one example of a group member saying that and I will
apologize to you for the bad names I have called you, braindead
one.
--
Spelling and grammatical errors are deliberate
to catch copyright violators. ©¿©¬
Perth, Ontario, Canada

QQQte@webtv.net

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

well i've given up on the replys here as it seems you all thought it out
and i grew up where you fought it out...... i want to kick toms XXX so
bad i can taste blood in my mouth..... but when i think about it he's
not worth my time but your replies are and i enjoy them and there fore i
really haven't given up on you:-) i'm just in a pissy XXX hell of mood
today..... dory

........" There is so much good in the worst of us and so much bad in
the best of us that its rather hard to discern which of us ought to
reform the rest of us"...........
.........Alain Fournier.........

Joan Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:06:05 -0400, J <ware@anon.anon> wrote in
alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>Joan, your're using Forte Agent.
>According to someone else, select his post then:
>Press 'Ctrl & K' at the same time, followed by 'I' (the letter I, not L)
>According to the other person, that should block all his posts (under his current
>email address) from your view for every newsgroup, but you'll still see his posts,
>if others reply to him.

Just kidding. It amuses me to pull the little twerp's chain, also to warn
newbies about him.
---
Joan

Joan Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 11:40:02 -0700, "Michael" <muirhead@haidagwaii.net> wrote in
alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>Joan Carter wrote:
>
>
>Garlic, silver cross and wooden stake.
>
Now, a sensible answer. Thanks, Michael, knew I could count on you. Should I
chop the garlic or not? Perth is known for its garlic, I can get lots of it. :-)
---
Joan

Joan Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On 18 Apr 2005 19:44:05 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com" <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote
in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>Have you something to .. say .. about .. cognition and oxidative stress
>.. ?
>
>How about .. cognition .. ?
>
>Keep it on topic and keep your personal comments to yourself ..

Oh my, the little fart is pissed off. <snicker>
---
Joan

Joan Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On 18 Apr 2005 20:03:38 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com" <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote
in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>So since .. group members HAVE SPECIFICALLY STATED COGNITION ARTICLES
>ARE .. welcomed .. YOU .. fk off ..
>
>Dig .. jrkff .. ?

Goodness, Tom Turd, did your mother never wash your mouth out with soap? She
should have. Tut, tut.
---
Joan

Joan Carter

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 23:59:19 -0400, Jim Carter <spamfree@sentex.ca> wrote in
alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>And why is the only symptom of MS that you mention is cognition.
>Do you have a simpleton's mind?

You're presuming Tom has a mind, Jim, that could be wrong.
---
Joan

Dangerous

2005-04-19, 10:39 am

You have nothing to add to this group. NOTHING...now wax off

--
Dora
Dangerous with Attitude

I do it cause I can
<ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1113879818.506295.280740@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> listen up you creepy fk ..
>
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
> The thread is .. cognition ..The thread is .. cognition ..
>
> So you UNDERSTAND ....The thread is .. cognition ..?
>
> So since .. group members HAVE SPECIFICALLY STATED COGNITION ARTICLES
> ARE .. welcomed .. YOU .. fk off ..
>
> Dig .. jrkff .. ?
>
> Who loves ya.
> Tom
> Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
> http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
> Man Is A Herbivore!
> http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/manisaherbivore
> DEADPEOPLE WALKING
> http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/deadpeoplewalking
>

Michael

2005-04-19, 11:48 am

Joan Carter wrote:

> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 11:40:02 -0700, "Michael"
> <muirhead@haidagwaii.net> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
> Now, a sensible answer. Thanks, Michael, knew I could count on you.
> Should I chop the garlic or not?

I think this recipe calls for chopping the recipient, actually...

>Perth is known for its garlic, I can
> get lots of it. :-) ---
> Joan

ironjustice@aol.com

2005-04-19, 10:57 pm

>>Show one example of a group member saying that and I will apologize
to you <<

http://tinyurl.com/bqfvd

Now .. fk .. off ..

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian !
http://herbivore.7h.com
Man Is A Herbivore!
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/manisaherbivore
Dead People Walking
http://pages.ivillage.com/ironjustice/deadpeoplewalking

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:57 pm

Joan Carter wrote:

> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 23:59:19 -0400, Jim Carter <spamfree@sentex.ca>
> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
>
> You're presuming Tom has a mind, Jim, that could be wrong.

Ah, but he *does* have a mind that could be wrong.

Jim Carter

2005-04-19, 10:57 pm

On 19 Apr 2005 17:58:44 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com"
<ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:

>http://tinyurl.com/bqfvd
>
>Now .. fk .. off ..

From three years ago, Tommy, and from a newbie who did not know
you. Sigh, I did give my word, though, so...

I apologize for all the bad names I have called you and will
endeavour to think up new bad names. Joan says she will help.
--
Spelling and grammatical errors are deliberate
to catch copyright violators. ©¿©¬
Perth, Ontario, Canada

Michael

2005-04-19, 10:57 pm

Jim Carter wrote:

> On 19 Apr 2005 17:58:44 -0700, "ironjustice@aol.com"
> <ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in alt.support.mult-sclerosis:
>
>
> From three years ago, Tommy, and from a newbie who did not know
> you. Sigh, I did give my word, though, so...
>
> I apologize for all the bad names I have called you and will
> endeavour to think up new bad names. Joan says she will help.

Bravo, Jim!

I'll personally thrash anyone who claims you're neither a gentleman nor a
man of your word.

Sharon Hope

2005-04-19, 10:57 pm

Yes, and this is also understood to be the mechanism for cognitive damage
from statin drugs (Lipitor, Crestor, Zocor, Pravachol, Lescol, Mevacor, and
Baycol).

Statin drugs depelete body of CoQ10, an antioxidant that is normally
manufactured in the body, but statins interrupt that process.

<ironjustice@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1113801507.453419.64710@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Neurology. 2005 Apr 12;64(7):1152-6. Links
>
>
> Evidence of increased oxidative damage in subjects with mild cognitive
> impairment.
>
> Keller JN, Schmitt FA, Scheff SW, Ding Q, Chen Q, Butterfield DA,
> Markesbery WR.
>
> Department of Anatomy, university of Kentucky, Lexington 40536-0230,
> USA. Jnkell0@pop.uky.edu
>
> OBJECTIVE: To determine if increased levels of oxidative damage are
> present in the brains of persons with mild cognitive impairment (MCI),
> a condition that often precedes Alzheimer disease (AD). METHODS: The
> authors assessed the amount of protein carbonyls, thiobarbituric
> acid-reactive substances (TBARS), and malondialdehyde in the superior
> and middle temporal gyri (SMTG) and cerebellum of short postmortem
> interval and longitudinally evaluated normal subjects and those with
> MCI and early AD. RESULTS: Elevated levels of protein carbonyls
> (approximately 25%), malondialdehyde (approximately 60%), and TBARS
> (approximately 210%) were observed in the SMTG of individuals with MCI
> and early AD vs normal control subjects. The elevation in TBARS was
> associated with the numbers of neuritic but not diffuse plaques. Levels
> of protein carbonyls increased as delayed verbal memory performance
> declined. CONCLUSION: Oxidative damage occurs in the brain of subjects
> with mild cognitive impairment, suggesting that oxidative damage may be
> one of the earliest events in the onset and progression of Alzheimer
> disease.
>
> PMID: 15824339 [PubMed - in process]
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Who loves ya.
> Tom
>
> Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
> http://herbivore.7h.com
>

Robert

2005-04-20, 8:52 am

"Sharon Hope" <shope@anet.net> wrote in message
news:5LOdnXCkDtTMUfjfRVn-qg@comcast.com...
> Yes, and this is also understood to be the mechanism for cognitive damage
> from statin drugs (Lipitor, Crestor, Zocor, Pravachol, Lescol, Mevacor,
and
> Baycol).
Understood mechanism for cognitive damage?
Maybe it's the milk they are drinking?
Here's the proven understood mechanism. The milk causes your lungs to glue
together and causes depletion of oxygen and in so doing your body is forced
into making ROS causing the damage.
That's been understood for many years now.

>
> Statin drugs depelete body of CoQ10, an antioxidant that is normally
> manufactured in the body, but statins interrupt that process.

Everybody knows that. There's a million people with muscle damage and renal
failure and cognitive damage.

Sharon Hope

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

"Robert" <Robertitsme@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tumdnQ1NStAIZfjfRVn-3A@got.net...
>
> "Sharon Hope" <shope@anet.net> wrote in message
> news:5LOdnXCkDtTMUfjfRVn-qg@comcast.com...
> and
> Understood mechanism for cognitive damage?
> Maybe it's the milk they are drinking?
> Here's the proven understood mechanism. The milk causes your lungs to glue
> together and causes depletion of oxygen and in so doing your body is
> forced
> into making ROS causing the damage.
> That's been understood for many years now.
>
>
> Everybody knows that. There's a million people with muscle damage and
> renal
> failure and cognitive damage.
>
>

Actually, there is measurable evidence of cognitive damage after only 6
months of statin use. See Dr. Muldoon's studies.

Randomized trial of the effects of simvastatin on cognitive functioning in
hypercholesterolemic adults.
Am J Med. 2004 Dec 1;117(11):823-9.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=15589485
Effects of lovastatin on cognitive function and psychological well-being.
Am J Med. 2000 May;108(7):538-46.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=10806282

BTW, CoQ10 affects quite a bit of the body, and a deficiency caused by
statin drugs can impact the body in many ways. See the presentations from
last weekend below:

Programme of the 4th Conference of the International Coenzyme Q10
Association

Beverly Hilton, Los Angeles, April 14-17 2005

Thursday, April 14th

14.00 - 19.00 Registration

19.00 Welcome reception

Friday, April 15th

8.30 - 8.50: Introductory remarks:

Bioenergetics and Biosynthesis
Chairpersons: G. Lenaz and E. Cadenas

8.50 G. Lenaz The existence of supercomplexes of the mitochondrial
respiratory chain:

the role of Coenzyme Q diffusion and implications in human
pathology

9.10 G. Dallner Regulation of coenzyme Q synthesis by endogenous modified

intermediates

9.30 C. Clarke Genetic and Physical Evidence for a Coenzyme Q
Biosynthetic Complex

9.50 J. Olsson Reduction of coenzyme Q10 by thioredoxin reductase. A
reaction

dependent on the selenium concentration.

10.10 - 10.30 Discussion

10.30 - 10.50 Coffee break

10.50 P. Navas Q biosynthesis during development and aging
11.10 M. Kawamukai Prenyl diphosphate synthases from higher eukaryotes

11.30 - 11.40 Discussion

Non mitochondrial electron transport and antioxidant
aspects

Chairpersons: T. Kishi and L. Packer

11.40 T. Kishi Extra-mitochndrial CoQ redox cycle and cellular defense
mechanism

12.00 J. Villalba Interference of cell cycle checkpoint by quinone
reductase inhibitors.

12.20 J. Morrè CoQ/CoQH2 ratios from plasma membrane electron transport
ceramide

and shingosine-1-phosphate levels during GL arrest and apoptosis.

12.40 - 13.00 Discussion

13.00 - 14.30 Lunch

Plasma and tissue
concentrations

Chairpersons: GP Littarru and T. Menke

14.30 M. Miles Serum levels in children, adults and in metabolic syndrome

14.50 P. Palan Serum levels in pregnancy and menopause

15.10 T. Menke Measurement of CoQ10 in plasma and blood cells in
childhood: Age

related reference values, disease related changes and
comparison of values in

plasma and blood cells after oral supplementation

15.30 Lili Miles CoQ10 content of skeletal muscle

15.50 RB. Singh Effect of oral coenzymeQ10 dosages on serum Q10 and MDA
levels among healthy men.

16.10 - 16.30 Discussion

16.30 - 16.50 Coffee break

Effect of CoQ10 in gene expression

Chairpersons: C. Clarke and G. Dallner

16.50 D. Groneberg Coenzyme Q10 affects expression of genes involved in
cell signalling, metabolism and transport in human CaCo-2 cells

17.10 H. Nohl Ubiquinol and the papeverine derivative caroverin prevent
the

expression of tumor-promoting factors involved in
coloncarcinogenesis induced by

dietary-fat nutrition

17.30 -17.50 Discussion

17.50 - 18.30 Poster Session - R. Kalpravidh (beta-thalassemia), De
Luca-Korkina

(Coenzyme Q10 treatment in burns)

18.30 - 19.30 Meeting of participants involved in the Q-Symbio trial

Saturday, April 16th

Neuromuscular and neurodegenerative diseases
Chairpersons: C. Shults and A. Naini

8.30 F. Beal Preclinical Studies of CoQ in Neurodegenerative
Diseases and Clinical Trials

8.50 Geng Li Volume MRI Study: The effects of Coenzyme Q10 in
Transgenic Mouse Models of Alzheimer's Disease and Cerebral Ischemia

9.10 R. Artuch Familiar cerebellar ataxia caused by primary coenzyme Q10
deficiency

9.30 C. Shults Clinical Trials of Coenzyme Q10 in Neurological Diseases

9.50 Y. Yamamoto Redox status of CoQ in neurodegenerative syndromes

10.10-10.30 Discussion

10.30 -10.50 Coffee break

Role in aging mechanisms

Chairpersons: P. Navas and R. Sohal

10.50 R. Sohal Effects of coenzyme Q intake on the aging process

11.10 J. Quiles Coenzyme Q supplementation in aging

11.30 S. Hekimi Multiple ubiquinone-dependent processes as revealed by
clk-1 mutants

11.50 C. Santos Ocana Yeast YML125C, a Q-dependent PM reductase and
aging

control

12.10 -12.30 Discussion

12.30 - 14.30 Lunch break

Cardiovascular diseases

Chairpersons: SA. Mortensen and R. Belardinelli

14.30 B. Golomb Clinical follow-up after stopping statin treatment

14.50 P. Langsjoen Adverse consequences of HMG-CoA reductase inhibitors in

clinical cardiology and their response to supplemental CoQ10

15.10 M. Silver Lipitor/CoQ10/Diastolic Dysfunction study

15.30 H. Mabuchi Reduction of Serum Ubiquinol-10 and Ubiquinone-10 Levels
by

Atorvastatin in Hypercholesterolemic Patients

15.50 K. Adarsh Atorvastatin alone/in combination with coenzyme Q10 in 103
cases of

heart failure (HF) due to ischemic cardiomyopathy (ICM).

16.10 - 16.30 Discussion

16.30 - 16.50 Coffee break

Chairpersons: P. Langsjoen and B. Golomb

16.50 SA. Mortensen Q-Symbio study status

17.10 F. Rosenfeldt Metabolic, Physical and Mental preoperative approach
to surgery

17.30 R. Stocker Plasma CoQ10 concentration and cardiovascular disease
outcome

17.50 R. Belardinelli High-dose coenzymeQ10 improves the contractile
response to

dobutamine of dysfunctional myocardium in patients with ischemic

cardiomyopathy

18.10 - 18.30 Discussion

18.30 - 19.30 Poster session

20.00 Social dinner

Sunday, April 17th

Various clinical fields

Chairperson: Udo Hoppe and F. Beal

8.40 E. Teran Preeclampsia and CoQ10

9.00 A. Mancini CoQ10 levels in sperm cells and seminal plasma:

physiopathological implications

9.20 G. Balercia Treatment of idiopathic asthenozoospermia with coenzyme
Q10

9.40 Y. Ashida (Shiseido) CoQ10 intake elevates the epidermal CoQ10 level
in adult

hairless mice

10.00 T. Blatt (Beiersdorf) Stimulation of the Skin`s Energy Metabolism
Provides
Multiple Benefits

10.20-10.40 Discussion
10.40 -11.00 Coffee break

11.00 O. Gabrielli CoQ10 trial in Down syndrome

11.40 L. Korkina Coenzyme Q in treatment of the alkali-injured rabbit
cornea

12.0 J. Feher CoQ10 in combination with acetyl-L-carnitine and
omega -3 improves

age-related macular degeneration

12.20 Discussion and conclusions

13.00 Lunch

Michael

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

Jim Carter

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

Jim Carter

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

ironjustice@aol.com

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

Michael

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

Evelyn Ruut

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

"Sharon Hope" <shope@anet.net> wrote in message
news:LtqdnfGN6PTpuPrfRVn-vg@comcast.com...
>
> "Robert" <Robertitsme@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:tumdnQ1NStAIZfjfRVn-3A@got.net...
>
> Actually, there is measurable evidence of cognitive damage after only 6
> months of statin use. See Dr. Muldoon's studies.
>
> Randomized trial of the effects of simvastatin on cognitive functioning in
> hypercholesterolemic adults.
> Am J Med. 2004 Dec 1;117(11):823-9.
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=15589485
> Effects of lovastatin on cognitive function and psychological well-being.
> Am J Med. 2000 May;108(7):538-46.
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=10806282
>
> BTW, CoQ10 affects quite a bit of the body, and a deficiency caused by
> statin drugs can impact the body in many ways. See the presentations from
> last weekend below:
>
> Programme of the 4th Conference of the International Coenzyme Q10
> Association
>
> Beverly Hilton, Los Angeles, April 14-17 2005

I was taking 150 mg of coenzyme Q-10 per day while I was taking lipitor, and
I still had horrible side effects of muscle pain and extreme muscle
weakness.

It may have some effect on memory, but it certainly isn't the cause of
alzheimers. My mother in law never took a statin drug and she is dying this
moment at 84 of the disease. My father is 92 and he is doing fine, been on
statin drugs for years.

I have seen your posts before regarding statin drugs.
Are you a troll?

--
Best Regards,
Evelyn

(to reply personally, remove 'sox')

Susan

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

x-no-archive: yes

Evelyn Ruut wrote:

> I was taking 150 mg of coenzyme Q-10 per day while I was taking lipitor, and
> I still had horrible side effects of muscle pain and extreme muscle
> weakness.
>
> It may have some effect on memory, but it certainly isn't the cause of
> alzheimers. My mother in law never took a statin drug and she is dying this
> moment at 84 of the disease. My father is 92 and he is doing fine, been on
> statin drugs for years.
>
> I have seen your posts before regarding statin drugs.
> Are you a troll?
>

Sharon isn't a troll, she's a necessary counterbalance to all the well
heeled drug peddlers out there.

The information she presents is always useful, even if her assertions
are sometimes a tad broad.

Susan

Evelyn Ruut

2005-04-21, 8:53 am

"Susan" <Susan@nothankyou.com> wrote in message
news:3cpjncF6m8cr1U1@individual.net...
> x-no-archive: yes

> Sharon isn't a troll, she's a necessary counterbalance to all the well
> heeled drug peddlers out there.
>
> The information she presents is always useful, even if her assertions are
> sometimes a tad broad.
>
> Susan

Hi Susan,

I do respect your opinion (as you already know) and was planning to write to
you again about your regimen for alternative cholesterol control. Please
post it again, and if you would prefer, you could write me again personally
with it. Be sure to remove "sox" from my address.

After we last spoke, my doctor pursuaded me to give the Lipitor a second
shot. It worked, (got down to under 200) but the cost in quality of life,
was too high! Been off it for a week and I already feel better!

--
Best Regards,
Evelyn

(to reply personally, remove 'sox')

Sharon Hope

2005-04-22, 10:51 pm

"Evelyn Ruut" <mama-lionsox@hvc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:imM9e.16357$mp6.1524050@twister.nyc.rr.com...
>
>
> "Sharon Hope" <shope@anet.net> wrote in message
> news:LtqdnfGN6PTpuPrfRVn-vg@comcast.com...
>
>
> I was taking 150 mg of coenzyme Q-10 per day while I was taking lipitor,
> and I still had horrible side effects of muscle pain and extreme muscle
> weakness.
>
> It may have some effect on memory, but it certainly isn't the cause of
> alzheimers. My mother in law never took a statin drug and she is dying
> this moment at 84 of the disease. My father is 92 and he is doing fine,
> been on statin drugs for years.
>

Evelyn,

No, the memory loss from statin drugs is real, and is just as debilitating
as Alzheimers, but does not cause death (to my knowledge) - although the
muscle damage from statins can cause death by rhabdomyolysis.

Alzheimer's is a separate and distinct condition.

Never in any of my posts will you see me confuse the two. They are
absolutely different.

HOWEVER, there are many many MANY primary care physicians who DO confuse the
two. Many many statin patients who are suffering cognitive damage from
statins, including extreme short-term memory loss and multiple episodes of
transient global amnesia, are at first MISDIAGNOSED as having Alzheimer's.
In this misdiagnosis, not only is there the additional stress and trauma of
being told INCORRECTLY that they have Alzheimers, but the statin drug, which
is CAUSING the damage, is continued to be prescribed, so the damage worsens
until they get Alzheimers ruled out.

I have asked several times, and have read other people ask, and they have
always been told that this is a support group for people with, and families
of people with MEMORY LOSS, and it does not have to be just Alzheimer's.

> I have seen your posts before regarding statin drugs.
> Are you a troll?

I am the wife (of 38 years) of a man who was twice a corporate CEO, who took
Lipitor 10mg/day for 4 years in his mid-50's and is now completely disabled
from Lipitor side effects. He has been off the Lipitor for 3 years and has
worked weekly with a Cognitive Rehabilitation Therapist, struggling to
recover from these adverse effects. His neuromuscular damage is so
debilitating that he can hardly walk - a major improvement from the day that
he stopped taking the Lipitor. He is in constant excruciating chronic pain.
His short term memory is still in the NP-tested "Impaired" range. His
business is gone and he is unable to conduct daily activities in any
semblance of his pre-Lipitor routine.

Since he was afflicted by these horrific side effects and has become so
thoroughly disabled and is in so much pain and distress, I have made the
discovery that many, many others are similarly affected.

Since this is a support group that welcomes families of those with horrific
memory loss, and I am one of those, I come to this group for support, as
many others do. I also offer my experience and what I have learned up to
others who might have been misled into thinking their loved one has
Alzheimers, if it is in fact possible or even likely that the damage is
actually a side effect of the most-prescribed of all drugs in the world
right now, and in history: Statins.

So far, the tragedy of Alzheimer's is not yet preventable.

Statin Cognitive Damage is absolutely preventable - it only takes an
awareness campaign and doctors monitoring for it. So far they do not.
There is no reason for people to suffer statin memory loss, but far too many
do experience it. I am in contact with 2 women this month alone, whose
husbands were tested below the 10 percentile in short-term memory, DUE TO
STATINS. I know of 3 families who have lost their homes JUST THIS MONTH due
to the economic impact of this disabling condition striking the breadwinner.

How many people asked you if there were any chance of statin adverse effects
being eliminated as the cause of memory loss in the significant person in
your family, prior to a diagnosis of ALZ? Any? Why not?

You can read about my husband's case at:
http://www.n3inc.com/SmartMoneyReprint_103003Web.pdf

You can read about some of his amnesia episodes in "Lipitor, Thief of
Memory" at http://www.spacedoc.net/

There are also publication-pending medical studies that contain his case.

>
> --
> Best Regards,
> Evelyn
>
> (to reply personally, remove 'sox')
>
>

steve@tropheus.demon.co.uk

2005-04-22, 10:51 pm

outrider@despammed.com

2005-04-23, 8:53 am

Susan wrote:
> x-no-archive: yes
>
> Evelyn Ruut wrote:
>
lipitor, and[vbcol=seagreen]
[vbcol=seagreen]
of[vbcol=seagreen]
dying this[vbcol=seagreen]
been on[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Sharon isn't a troll, she's a necessary counterbalance to all the
well
> heeled drug peddlers out there.
>
> The information she presents is always useful, even if her assertions

> are sometimes a tad broad.
>
> Susan

I can attest that Sharon Hope is not a troll. Nor am I. And though I
have had cognitive damage from statins, including short term memory
loss, working memory loss (what you need to learn), aphasia (loss of
language, word loss, vocabularly loss, confusion of words, spelling and
syntax difficulties, forgetting what you want to say by the time you
get to the end of the sentence, inability to follow a conversation;
loss of memory of things one used to do for years for example driving a
car or knitting, spatial loss, becoming lost in one's own
neighbourhood, forgetting if one ate, or how to get dressed--on and on.
I have partly recovered so I can tell people: statin cognitive damage
is real. It is not Alzheimerer's although often misdiagnosed as such,
and although if caught in time one can recover, it can cause permanent
damage. I know people who will never recover from frontal lobe damage
and damage to the cerrebelum.

Alheimer's is a terrible disease. Do not accept this diagnosis without
a complete examination of ALL the possibilities.

Most of all, do not let anyone with dubious motives imply you or your
affected loved one are a "tad broad" or mentally ill.

Zee

QQQte@webtv.net

2005-04-24, 5:55 pm

i can't take statins because of the weakness and muscle pain. it took
months to figure out what was going on with me and yep my pcp who had
prescribed them for me thought i was a nut... so out of his frustration
sent me to a neuro. by the way i fired my pcp face to face and didn't
mince words with his poor quality of care...

the first question the neuro asked me was what meds i was on. bingo:-)
he noticed the statin and pulled me off. he then run muscle emzine (sp)
studies on me.....

i am not a candidate for statins darn it:-( so my blood fat remains at
238 and i really watch my diet. i do know about the studies re: zocar
and i hope it turns out to be helpful for ms... but then again it's time
will tell..... dory

........" There is so much good in the worst of us and so much bad in
the best of us that its rather hard to discern which of us ought to
reform the rest of us"...........
.........Alain Fournier.........

QQQte@webtv.net

2005-04-26, 10:57 pm

Evelyn Ruut

2005-04-27, 5:56 pm

Susan

2005-04-27, 5:56 pm

Evelyn Ruut

2005-04-27, 5:56 pm