|
Home > Archive > Chronic pain Support > January 2005 > Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
You are viewing an archived Text-only version of the thread.
To view this thread in it's original format and/or if you want to reply to
this thread please [click here]
| Author |
Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
|
|
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| Re: Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
'allo,
I am a "Hairy Beast" of 58 yrs, 5'6", 140 lbs.
I started taking hydrocodone/apap 10/660 mg post-op about
3 years ago. Have been going to a pain mgmt. clinic for
2+ years. In possession of a fair portfolio of pain
sources.
I'm now on low dosages (about 20 mg hc/day) but I take it
every day and there is little prospect of taking less in
the future.
What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term? I seem to
be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
and ...). It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
sleep.
Any/all info much appreciated.
Cheers,
Puddin'
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| loose_cannon@surfy.net 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| Puddin' Man wrote:
> Re: Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
>
> 'allo,
>
> I am a "Hairy Beast" of 58 yrs, 5'6", 140 lbs.
>
> I started taking hydrocodone/apap 10/660 mg post-op about
> 3 years ago. Have been going to a pain mgmt. clinic for
> 2+ years. In possession of a fair portfolio of pain
> sources.
>
> I'm now on low dosages (about 20 mg hc/day) but I take it
> every day and there is little prospect of taking less in
> the future.
>
> What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term? I seem to
> be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
> and ...). It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
> sleep.
Not allot. Its not the hydrocodone thatll getcha. Its the Tylenol in
it. At the dose yer on, which according to you is only 1320mg/day of it
(660 x 2), yer safe. Depending on who ya talk to, the danger dose can
be anywhere from 2000 to 4000 mg/day, depending on how strong yer liver
is, if you drink, etc.
As far as the virility thing goes, check into testosterone supplements.
Thats one thing that long term opiates does to to men, esp. those of
us middle aged, is lower testosterone levels resulting in reduced
virility. There is also believed to be a male version of menopause that
brings on reduced testosterone levels in yer system even without the
opiates.
Some use testosterone patches, some use gel, some use shots. Depends on
yer insurance, I guess.
>
> Any/all info much appreciated.
Hope this helps.
>
> Cheers,
> Puddin'
>
> ******************************************************
> *** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
> ******************************************************;
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:39:28 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote something wonderfully witty:
>Re: Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
>
>'allo,
>
>I am a "Hairy Beast" of 58 yrs, 5'6", 140 lbs.
>
>I started taking hydrocodone/apap 10/660 mg post-op about
>3 years ago. Have been going to a pain mgmt. clinic for
>2+ years. In possession of a fair portfolio of pain
>sources.
>
>I'm now on low dosages (about 20 mg hc/day) but I take it
>every day and there is little prospect of taking less in
>the future.
>
>What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term? I seem to
>be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
>and ...). It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
>sleep.
>
>Any/all info much appreciated.
>
> Cheers,
> Puddin'
>
Do you sort of feel like a fat old neutered male cat that just wants
to lay in a sunny spot, sleep and eat? If so have your Doctor check
your testosterone levels. It is just a simple blood test. If your
level is below 270 you probably need to be on some type of
testosterone replacement therapy. There are at least three things
that can cause your testosterone levels to be low. Chronic Pain,
Opiate usage, and age. Looks like you hit the trifecta. Very little
research has gone into the male version of menopause, which is called
Andropause. Most of the research I am aware of on the subject has
come out of the UK. You can do web searches to find out more
information.
As to the long-term usage of hydrocodone/apap it isn't the hydrocodone
that maybe the long-term problem maker. It would be the apap. Do a
web search on "Long-term Acetaminophen usage" and you will come across
web sites such as http://tinyurl.com/3u56d which talk about some of
the issues.
Personally if you think you are going to be on this type of medication
for a long-term period I would talk to my Dr about switching me to one
of the medications without the APAP or look at using one of the
versions of long-acting drugs for chronic pain.
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| Jon Miller 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:39:28 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote:
>Re: Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
>
<snip
>What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term? I seem to
>be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
>and ...). It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
>sleep.
I also have problems getting to sleep when I take pretty much any
opiates. Then I fall asleep during the day, because I'm tired, and
then I'm in a vicious cycle because it's doubly hard to get to sleep
the second night, both because of the pain and the opiates and because
my sleep cycle is off because I've slept too much during the day.
How long have you been on this dosage? After your body gets used to
it, this difficulty getting to sleep should go away. Unless it
doesn't, of course. (Life is more complicated than usenet. Sucks for
those of us that are alive.)
Talk to your doctor about it, if it doesn't go away.
Jon Miller
| |
| old goat 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| Dear Puddin,
Get off the acetaminophen (APAP). will cause kidney and liver problem in
high enough quantities and long enough use. Look at the big number (325
,500) and figure you use from that number. The hydrocodone wont do you in,
it's the Tylenol (all the same stuff - apap, acetaminophen, parecetemol,
tylenol) that will. Given your weight of 140 I'd stay on the conservative
side of what and when to call it a dangerous dose and the numbers run from
2000mg to 4000mg a day, the latest I've seen falling right in between at
3000mg along with a warning that due to some recent research liver damage
is caused by "significantly lower levels than previously thought."
If it looks as though this is going to be a lifetime need ask about a long
acting, or just pure opiate without any of the extra crap. You can add
Tylenol quite easily enough on your own, just treat those number with some
respect, and it wouldn't do you any harm (especially if you drink even
lightly) to have liver function tests done every couple months at least.
Does this mean you gave up on the blocks or that the block was a waste of
time? If you're still thinking of it, might be worth a shot (no pun
intended) even though it is a XXXXX of a place to get zapped.
Best of Luck, Puddin --og
Puddin' Man <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in article
<41f3d4cc.4011518@news.west.earthlink.net>...
> Re: Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
>
> 'allo,
>
> I am a "Hairy Beast" of 58 yrs, 5'6", 140 lbs.
>
> I started taking hydrocodone/apap 10/660 mg post-op about
> 3 years ago. Have been going to a pain mgmt. clinic for
> 2+ years. In possession of a fair portfolio of pain
> sources.
>
> I'm now on low dosages (about 20 mg hc/day) but I take it
> every day and there is little prospect of taking less in
> the future.
>
> What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term? I seem to
> be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
> and ...). It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
> sleep.
>
> Any/all info much appreciated.
>
> Cheers,
> Puddin'
>
> ******************************************************
> *** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
> ******************************************************;
>
| |
|
| "Puddin' Man" <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in message
news:41f3d4cc.4011518@news.west.earthlink.net
> What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term?
It's likely that you will slowly build up a tolerance over the long term
and you'll have to increase your daily dosage to get the same amount of
pain relief, but that shouldn't concern you or your doctor.
> I seem to
> be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
> and ...).
That's a common side effect of narcotics and aging and nothing to worry
about as long as you can still take care of business when you want to.
Don't be embarassed to tell your doctor about it.
> It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
> sleep.
Try to keep your schedule as regular as possible and avoid taking naps.
--
Juba
www.masterjuba.com
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:31:39 -0500, ZombyWoof <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net>
wrote:
>Do you sort of feel like a fat old neutered male cat that just wants
>to lay in a sunny spot, sleep and eat?
Oh, it's not *that* bad. But I make a purty good couch-potato
by the time the sun goes down (always did).
>If so have your Doctor check
>your testosterone levels. It is just a simple blood test.
I'm a "Hard, Hard Stick" ...
>If your
>level is below 270 you probably need to be on some type of
>testosterone replacement therapy. There are at least three things
>that can cause your testosterone levels to be low. Chronic Pain,
>Opiate usage, and age. Looks like you hit the trifecta.
Succintly put. To varying degrees no doubt true.
>Very little
>research has gone into the male version of menopause, which is called
>Andropause. Most of the research I am aware of on the subject has
>come out of the UK. You can do web searches to find out more
>information.
>
>As to the long-term usage of hydrocodone/apap it isn't the hydrocodone
>that maybe the long-term problem maker. It would be the apap. Do a
>web search on "Long-term Acetaminophen usage" and you will come across
>web sites such as http://tinyurl.com/3u56d which talk about some of
>the issues.
Info on daily dosage that I -should- have included in the
original post:
1.) Acetaminophen 4000 mg
2.) Ibuprofen 1600 mg
3.) Hydrocodone (hc) ~20 mg
I have an aversion to taking opiates during the day. Tend
to run on 1.) and 2.) sll day. Use all 3 in the evening
(when back and other pain hurts most).
Aside from the hc, I suspect the Ibuprofen does the most good.
>Personally if you think you are going to be on this type of medication
>for a long-term period I would talk to my Dr about switching me to one
>of the medications without the APAP or look at using one of the
>versions of long-acting drugs for chronic pain.
I've been half-afraid to ask. The hc is cheap, effective, and
it doesn't attract attention. Is hc available w/o apap? I've
not heard of such.
Thanks,
Puddin'
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 12:53:36 -0600, Jon Miller
<jonmillere1@comcast.net> wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:39:28 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
>wrote:
>
><snip
>
>
>I also have problems getting to sleep when I take pretty much any
>opiates. Then I fall asleep during the day, because I'm tired, and
>then I'm in a vicious cycle because it's doubly hard to get to sleep
>the second night, both because of the pain and the opiates and because
>my sleep cycle is off because I've slept too much during the day.
What you describe is *precisely* what I must avoid. I did OK
with irregular/crazy hours when I was young: I ain't young no mo'!
>How long have you been on this dosage? After your body gets used to
>it, this difficulty getting to sleep should go away. Unless it
>doesn't, of course. (Life is more complicated than usenet. Sucks for
>those of us that are alive.)
It bothers me most with a flare-up, when taking more than
usual. It's like I'm in suspended animation ...
>Talk to your doctor about it, if it doesn't go away.
Will do.
Cheers,
Puddin'
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
|
| ugh, if this is gerenic lortab/hydro i just started to get off it after 15
months using it, it was hell the last 6 months, try and move up imho, i felt
like death taking it, best luck...joe
"Puddin' Man" <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in message
news:41f3d4cc.4011518@news.west.earthlink.net...
> Re: Long-term effects of hydrocodone usage
>
> 'allo,
>
> I am a "Hairy Beast" of 58 yrs, 5'6", 140 lbs.
>
> I started taking hydrocodone/apap 10/660 mg post-op about
> 3 years ago. Have been going to a pain mgmt. clinic for
> 2+ years. In possession of a fair portfolio of pain
> sources.
>
> I'm now on low dosages (about 20 mg hc/day) but I take it
> every day and there is little prospect of taking less in
> the future.
>
> What's it going to do to po' me in the long-term? I seem to
> be less virile, but, of course, I'm getting older (and older
> and ...). It also seems to make it a bit harder to get to
> sleep.
>
> Any/all info much appreciated.
>
> Cheers,
> Puddin'
>
> ******************************************************
> *** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
> ******************************************************;
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 19:46:24 GMT, "old goat"
<oldgoatmailatyahoodotcom@ERdocs.suk> wrote:
>Dear Puddin,
>Get off the acetaminophen (APAP). will cause kidney and liver problem in
>high enough quantities and long enough use. Look at the big number (325
>,500) and figure you use from that number.
Info on daily dosage that I -should- have included in the
original post:
1.) Acetaminophen 4000 mg
2.) Ibuprofen 1600 mg
3.) Hydrocodone (hc) ~20 mg
I have an aversion to taking opiates during the day. Tend
to run on 1.) and 2.) all day. Use all 3 in the evening
(when back and other pain is worst).
Aside from the hc, I suspect the Ibuprofen does the most good.
>The hydrocodone wont do you in,
That's good to hear. I hadn't heard anything good or bad about
it's long-term usage.
>it's the Tylenol (all the same stuff - apap, acetaminophen, parecetemol,
>tylenol) that will. Given your weight of 140 I'd stay on the conservative
>side of what and when to call it a dangerous dose and the numbers run from
>2000mg to 4000mg a day, the latest I've seen falling right in between at
>3000mg along with a warning that due to some recent research liver damage
>is caused by "significantly lower levels than previously thought."
Ouch!
>If it looks as though this is going to be a lifetime need ask about a long
>acting, or just pure opiate without any of the extra crap.
Is hc available w/o apap? I've not heard of such. If not,
what pure opiate is cheap, effective, and doesn't attract
much attention?
>You can add
>Tylenol quite easily enough on your own, just treat those number with some
>respect, and it wouldn't do you any harm (especially if you drink even
>lightly)
1 drink / day.
>to have liver function tests done every couple months at least.
>Does this mean you gave up on the blocks or that the block was a waste of
>time? If you're still thinking of it, might be worth a shot (no pun
>intended) even though it is a XXXXX of a place to get zapped.
og, you are a Good, Good Fella to remember my little difficulties.
Left hip pain was killin' me, I tried a Sacro-iliac joint
injection. Didn't seem to help.
After torturing about the genito-femoral nerve block for about
a year, and confirming with the pm doc that he *cannot* see
-any- nerves on the fleuroscope, I decided that the risk/
expectation-of-reward ratio was unfavorable. I think the real
problem is in L1, L2, and L5 vertebra, and there's no easy
fix for that.
I gotta write myself a note: next time my pcp draws blood,
they should check for liver function and testerone ...
Much thanks,
Puddin'
[vbcol=seagreen]
>Puddin' Man <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in article
><41f3d4cc.4011518@news.west.earthlink.net>...
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| loose_cannon@surfy.net 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| ZombyWoof wrote:
> On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:39:28 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
> wrote something wonderfully witty:
>
>
>
> Do you sort of feel like a fat old neutered male cat that just wants
> to lay in a sunny spot, sleep and eat?
ROFL! Thats about the best description Ive seen for it too!
If so have your Doctor check
> your testosterone levels. It is just a simple blood test. If your
> level is below 270 you probably need to be on some type of
> testosterone replacement therapy. There are at least three things
> that can cause your testosterone levels to be low. Chronic Pain,
> Opiate usage, and age. Looks like you hit the trifecta. Very little
> research has gone into the male version of menopause, which is called
> Andropause. Most of the research I am aware of on the subject has
> come out of the UK. You can do web searches to find out more
> information.
>
> As to the long-term usage of hydrocodone/apap it isn't the hydrocodone
> that maybe the long-term problem maker. It would be the apap. Do a
> web search on "Long-term Acetaminophen usage" and you will come across
> web sites such as http://tinyurl.com/3u56d which talk about some of
> the issues.
>
> Personally if you think you are going to be on this type of medication
> for a long-term period I would talk to my Dr about switching me to one
> of the medications without the APAP or look at using one of the
> versions of long-acting drugs for chronic pain.
| |
|
|
"Juba" <juba@XmasterjubaX.com> wrote in message
news:ct124d$fhr$0@pita.alt.net...
> "Puddin' Man" <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:41f3d4cc.4011518@news.west.earthlink.net
>
> It's likely that you will slowly build up a tolerance over the long term
> and you'll have to increase your daily dosage to get the same amount of
> pain relief, but that shouldn't concern you or your doctor.
your right, my doctor wasn't concerned in the least when my tolerance begain
to build up, but i suely did...joe
>
>
> That's a common side effect of narcotics and aging and nothing to worry
> about as long as you can still take care of business when you want to.
> Don't be embarassed to tell your doctor about it.
i told my doctor i had gone to the bed ridden stage and it phased him not...
>
>
> Try to keep your schedule as regular as possible and avoid taking naps.
in my case this is impossible...joe
i know, my doctor sux but many may be stuck as i was, yess it's my fault
though...
>
> --
> Juba
> www.masterjuba.com
>
>
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:20:46 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote something wonderfully witty:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:31:39 -0500, ZombyWoof <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net>
>wrote:
>
>
>Oh, it's not *that* bad. But I make a purty good couch-potato
>by the time the sun goes down (always did).
>
>
>I'm a "Hard, Hard Stick" ...
>
Hard has a stick may or may not have anything to do with it, although
it can be part of the symptoms when you aren't, or rise to the
occasion, but can't make it through the entire party.
>
>Succintly put. To varying degrees no doubt true.
>
>
>Info on daily dosage that I -should- have included in the
>original post:
>
>1.) Acetaminophen 4000 mg
>2.) Ibuprofen 1600 mg
>3.) Hydrocodone (hc) ~20 mg
>
Personally, and only personally. From what I know I would cut
way-back on 1 & 2 especially in combination.
>I have an aversion to taking opiates during the day. Tend
>to run on 1.) and 2.) sll day. Use all 3 in the evening
>(when back and other pain hurts most).
>
>Aside from the hc, I suspect the Ibuprofen does the most good.
>
>
>I've been half-afraid to ask. The hc is cheap, effective, and
>it doesn't attract attention. Is hc available w/o apap? I've
>not heard of such.
>
I'd go with the other half. I am not aware of a pure hydrocodone,
perhaps it is available from a compounding pharmacy. There are
however other drugs that can be as effective that do not have the APAP
issues. With the amounts of NSAIDs you are taking (along with
drinking) am surprised you don't have some stomach or liver problems.
Personally I would ask your Doc to run a liver function test along
with the testosterone level check.
I used to be a big Excedrin user as well as a once upon a time binge
drinker. I ended up blowing out my stomach big time. Bleeding Ulcers
are no fun and mine were found-out almost a day to late. I damn near
woke up dead one day after crapping blood all night. Please get
yourself checked out as I suggested as well as look into some
alternatives to all of the NSAID usage. Tell the Doc the straight
skinny as well as your concerns, he should present you with some
alternatives if he is even a half-assed decent Doc.
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 15:12:03 -0800, "loose_cannon@surfy.net"
<loose_cannon@surfy.net> wrote something wonderfully witty:
>ZombyWoof wrote:
>
>ROFL! Thats about the best description Ive seen for it too!
>
Why thank you, thank you very much. I can lay claim to originality. I
came up with it after some astute observation of what was a rather
active Tommy Cat after he was about 6-months post-operative.
When using the above description my Doc immediately ordered the
Testosterone level check. He now uses it as a question, although
slightly more professionally worded.[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> If so have your Doctor check
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 22:37:40 -0500, ZombyWoof <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net>
wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:20:46 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
>wrote something wonderfully witty:
>
>Hard has a stick may or may not have anything to do with it, although
>it can be part of the symptoms when you aren't, or rise to the
>occasion, but can't make it through the entire party.
I made a goof. I assumed "hard stick" was a recognized med
term for "difficult to find a vein with the hypo". Difficult
to draw blood or inject IV. My pcp has drawn blood from
my femoral vein, but he hates to do it. Other docs and
the blood lab places (i.e. idiot Quest) flatly refuse to try.
-- SNIP --
>Personally, and only personally. From what I know I would cut
>way-back on 1 & 2 especially in combination.
I'm going to cut 1.) back to 2500 mg / day as an
experiment. May have to toy with 2.) as well (but later).
>I'd go with the other half. I am not aware of a pure hydrocodone,
>perhaps it is available from a compounding pharmacy.
I'm thinking "how many docs would get very nervous when
asked for a non-standard opiate compound?".
>There are
>however other drugs that can be as effective that do not have the APAP
>issues. With the amounts of NSAIDs you are taking (along with
>drinking) am surprised you don't have some stomach or liver problems.
>Personally I would ask your Doc to run a liver function test along
>with the testosterone level check.
Liver and testosterone tests are on my "ask" list as of now.
I tested positive for Hep C *antigen* a couple years ago,
and followed up with several blood tests, all of which
indicated liver function was OK. The last test might've
been a year ago.
Stomach problems have been with me for years, but dad had
'em (bad), and I've assumed it's genetic.
I take about 1.5 drinks per day.
>I used to be a big Excedrin user as well as a once upon a time binge
>drinker. I ended up blowing out my stomach big time. Bleeding Ulcers
>are no fun and mine were found-out almost a day to late. I damn near
>woke up dead one day after crapping blood all night.
Yeah, ya can't do that. Gotta stop, re-evaluate everything,
make some changes. I've had similar difficulties years ago.
>Please get
>yourself checked out as I suggested as well as look into some
>alternatives to all of the NSAID usage. Tell the Doc the straight
>skinny as well as your concerns, he should present you with some
>alternatives if he is even a half-assed decent Doc.
I have less-than-perfect confidence in any of my docs. With
all these years under my belt, I've learned to trust the med
profession (in general) approximately as far as I can shot-
put the Rock of Gibraltar. But I'll look into it.
If anyone knows of a common no-apap opiate which is
comparable to the "Vicodin" stuff for pain relief, I'm
all ears ...
Thanks,
Puddin'
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| natalya35@hotmail.com 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:20:46 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:31:39 -0500, ZombyWoof <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net>
>wrote:
>
>
>Oh, it's not *that* bad. But I make a purty good couch-potato
>by the time the sun goes down (always did).
>
>
>I'm a "Hard, Hard Stick" ...
Speaking as one who is an almost impossible stick - before going in to
have a blood draw, or anything else requiring a "stick", as long as
you are not NPO before a procedure, hydrate yourself to the moon -
drink, drink, drink - water, juice, all the fluids you can. It is
amazing the difference this can make. Also, before a stick, let the
"sticker" know and ask to have hot compresses put around your arms for
a few minutes. This too can make even tiny, spidery veins "pop" long
enough for the draw or IV or whatever. If the person doing the stick
knows you are a difficult stick they can prepare with a smaller
needle. I have had IV's using a 24, the size used on preemies, don't
last long, and wouldn't be used for surgery, but can be enough to get
some meds in you. Normal size for an adult is a 20, a believe. I know
this isn't the problem you are addressing here, but thought you might
find it useful should you unhappily find yourself needing an IV.
Just some tricks I have learned over the years, Hawki might have some
other suggestions to help prepare for a stick.
Nat
>
>
>Succintly put. To varying degrees no doubt true.
>
>
>Info on daily dosage that I -should- have included in the
>original post:
>
>1.) Acetaminophen 4000 mg
>2.) Ibuprofen 1600 mg
>3.) Hydrocodone (hc) ~20 mg
>
>I have an aversion to taking opiates during the day. Tend
>to run on 1.) and 2.) sll day. Use all 3 in the evening
>(when back and other pain hurts most).
>
>Aside from the hc, I suspect the Ibuprofen does the most good.
>
>
>I've been half-afraid to ask. The hc is cheap, effective, and
>it doesn't attract attention. Is hc available w/o apap? I've
>not heard of such.
>
> Thanks,
> Puddin'
>
>******************************************************
>*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
>******************************************************;
| |
|
| "xhead" <xhead@uwish.net> wrote in message
news:WiXId.20000$Os6.17174@trnddc08
> "Juba" <juba@XmasterjubaX.com> wrote in message
> news:ct124d$fhr$0@pita.alt.net...
>
> your right, my doctor wasn't concerned in the least when my tolerance
> begain to build up, but i suely did...joe
Well, that would be a good doctor, wouldn't it?
So many doctors are afraid to up the dosage even though they know it's
necessary to maintain the same level of pain relief.
--
Juba
www.masterjuba.com
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 10:44:13 -0800, "Juba" <Juba@XmasterjubaX.com>
wrote:
>"xhead" <xhead@uwish.net> wrote in message
>news:WiXId.20000$Os6.17174@trnddc08
Tolerance has always scared me. The idea of having to take
2, 3, 4 etc times the meds to achieve present level of
pain relief sounds like a potential nightmare (at least for
po' me).
Of course, there are circumstances/conditions that would
dictate the necessity ...
[vbcol=seagreen]
>Well, that would be a good doctor, wouldn't it?
>
>So many doctors are afraid to up the dosage even though they know it's
>necessary to maintain the same level of pain relief.
I fear there are many docs who would fail to identify the
circumstances/conditions (and exercise good judgment) due
to "Other Considerations".
Enough of my pissing/moaning ... <g>
Cheers,
Puddin'
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| LooseCannon 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| Puddin' Man wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 10:44:13 -0800, "Juba" <Juba@XmasterjubaX.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Tolerance has always scared me. The idea of having to take
> 2, 3, 4 etc times the meds to achieve present level of
> pain relief sounds like a potential nightmare (at least for
> po' me).
LOL, Id be THRILLED to just be at 2,3,4 times my original med dose to
get relief! After decades of pain and pain meds, my tolerance is thru
the roof.
>
> Of course, there are circumstances/conditions that would
> dictate the necessity ...
You bet yer arse there is! Ive tried cutting back, however, and have
even been succesful, to a point, but then I reach a plateau that if I
try to go below, I end up in agony, even when cutting back a tiny tiny
bit at a time!
When it serious pain, youd be amazed at what dictates necessity!
>
>
>
>
> I fear there are many docs who would fail to identify the
> circumstances/conditions (and exercise good judgment) due
> to "Other Considerations".
Yer right, but there are docs who recognize the truth when they see it.
Ive been a fortunate man to have the docs Ive had over the past 10 yrs.
>
> Enough of my pissing/moaning ... <g>
Aw, hell, that aint pissing or moaning! Those are legit worries!
>
> Cheers,
> Puddin'
>
> ******************************************************
> *** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
> ******************************************************;
| |
| old goat 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| Dear Puddin,
It's easy to remember somebody that was looking at the same block(G/F) that
scared the livin daylights out you, too. I did 6 of them so-and-so's,
before it hit with any kind of help, and then it was the permanent type, so
it also counts as a medical win in my book which makes it memorable, too.
Definitely get complete bloodwork done up, looking for liver and kidney and
other systemic damages, cause I hate to say it to you but the max number on
the Ibuprofen was lower than the acetaminophen. They got to have something
more effective as an anti inflammatory than the OTC stuff with less overall
risk to the rest of you. I was the same way too with the hydrocodone being
wayy better for me than the oxycodone, but you're going to have to find a
special pharmacy where they mix up their own medications(compounding) to
get straight HC.
Strange they just skip right over it on the "ladder of strength" but it
shows just how little they know about everyone getting better results with
this or that. Oxy will make a good replacement but it takes time to get
used to it or even a little dose of methadone would probably knock the pain
out all day long. You need a doc willing to try some new stuff, a minor bit
of serious pain reliever and a stronger anti inflammatory without the side
effects(although damn near all of the have some to one degree or another.)
sounds like what you're looking for. But get away from that ibuprophen/APAP
fast as you can. And the blood work!!
Good Luck--og
Puddin' Man <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in article
<41f4189f.21374364@news.west.earthlink.net>...
> On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 19:46:24 GMT, "old goat"
> <oldgoatmailatyahoodotcom@ERdocs.suk> wrote:
>
>
> Info on daily dosage that I -should- have included in the
> original post:
>
> 1.) Acetaminophen 4000 mg
> 2.) Ibuprofen 1600 mg
> 3.) Hydrocodone (hc) ~20 mg
>
> I have an aversion to taking opiates during the day. Tend
> to run on 1.) and 2.) all day. Use all 3 in the evening
> (when back and other pain is worst).
>
> Aside from the hc, I suspect the Ibuprofen does the most good.
>
>
> That's good to hear. I hadn't heard anything good or bad about
> it's long-term usage.
>
conservative[vbcol=seagreen]
from[vbcol=seagreen]
damage[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Ouch!
>
long[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Is hc available w/o apap? I've not heard of such. If not,
> what pure opiate is cheap, effective, and doesn't attract
> much attention?
>
some[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> 1 drink / day.
>
of[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> og, you are a Good, Good Fella to remember my little difficulties.
>
> Left hip pain was killin' me, I tried a Sacro-iliac joint
> injection. Didn't seem to help.
>
> After torturing about the genito-femoral nerve block for about
> a year, and confirming with the pm doc that he *cannot* see
> -any- nerves on the fleuroscope, I decided that the risk/
> expectation-of-reward ratio was unfavorable. I think the real
> problem is in L1, L2, and L5 vertebra, and there's no easy
> fix for that.
>
> I gotta write myself a note: next time my pcp draws blood,
> they should check for liver function and testerone ...
>
> Much thanks,
> Puddin'
>
>
>
>
> ******************************************************
> *** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
> ******************************************************;
>
| |
|
| how? i am now starting to get over being bedridden 80% of the day from it, i
basically lost over 8 months of my life dealing with him, i'm coming aound
now using oxy but it isn't fun or easy, he's just now coming around with my
pain center doctors orders, he was using a general dosage scale on me and
would not listen to my complaints about pain, that's why i was having such a
bad time a while back, it will take me months to get back to where i was
health wise, if i make it that far, it really was scewed up living it...joe
"Juba" <Juba@XmasterjubaX.com> wrote in message
news:ct3flt$cf5$0@pita.alt.net...
> "xhead" <xhead@uwish.net> wrote in message
> news:WiXId.20000$Os6.17174@trnddc08
>
> Well, that would be a good doctor, wouldn't it?
>
> So many doctors are afraid to up the dosage even though they know it's
> necessary to maintain the same level of pain relief.
>
> --
> Juba
> www.masterjuba.com
>
>
| |
|
|
"LooseCannon" <lambchop.LC@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:ct3o8t$i6l$1@upa.databasix.com...
> Puddin' Man wrote:
>
>
> LOL, Id be THRILLED to just be at 2,3,4 times my original med dose to
> get relief! After decades of pain and pain meds, my tolerance is thru
> the roof.
>
>
> You bet yer arse there is! Ive tried cutting back, however, and have
> even been succesful, to a point, but then I reach a plateau that if I
> try to go below, I end up in agony, even when cutting back a tiny tiny
> bit at a time!
>
> When it serious pain, youd be amazed at what dictates necessity!
>
>
> Yer right, but there are docs who recognize the truth when they see it.
> Ive been a fortunate man to have the docs Ive had over the past 10 yrs.
>
>
> Aw, hell, that aint pissing or moaning! Those are legit worries!
>
agreed 110% with both of you, thanks...joe
[vbcol=seagreen]
| |
| IPGrunt 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| "xhead" <xhead@uwish.net> confessed in news:OLfJd.12622$HT6.2890@trnddc04:
> how? i am now starting to get over being bedridden 80% of the day from it,
i
> basically lost over 8 months of my life dealing with him, i'm coming aound
> now using oxy but it isn't fun or easy, he's just now coming around with my
> pain center doctors orders, he was using a general dosage scale on me and
> would not listen to my complaints about pain, that's why i was having such
a
> bad time a while back, it will take me months to get back to where i was
> health wise, if i make it that far, it really was scewed up living it...joe
Sorry to hear this Joe,
FWIW, many of us CPers have spent years searching in vain for adequate pain
treatment before finding the correct treatment and/or practitioner that
brought relief and gave back our lives.
I do hope you find what you need, soon, and get back the life you deserve.
regards,
-- ipgrunt
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:28 am |
| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 18:00:56 GMT, natalya35@hotmail.com wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:20:46 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
>wrote:
--- snip ---
>
>Speaking as one who is an almost impossible stick - before going in to
>have a blood draw, or anything else requiring a "stick", as long as
>you are not NPO before a procedure, hydrate yourself to the moon -
>drink, drink, drink - water, juice, all the fluids you can. It is
>amazing the difference this can make.
I'll try it ...
>Also, before a stick, let the
>"sticker" know and ask to have hot compresses put around your arms for
>a few minutes. This too can make even tiny, spidery veins "pop" long
>enough for the draw or IV or whatever. If the person doing the stick
>knows you are a difficult stick they can prepare with a smaller
>needle. I have had IV's using a 24, the size used on preemies, don't
>last long, and wouldn't be used for surgery, but can be enough to get
>some meds in you. Normal size for an adult is a 20, a believe. I know
>this isn't the problem you are addressing here, but thought you might
>find it useful should you unhappily find yourself needing an IV.
I do find it potentially useful, and I very much appreciate
your suggestions.
>Just some tricks I have learned over the years, Hawki might have some
>other suggestions to help prepare for a stick.
I need all the tricks I can find ...
Back in '96 I needed simple hernia (open) surgery, went in
"cold" assuming the anesthesiologists could handle an IV. They
assualted me with several "stickers", turned me into a pincussion
whilst the po' surgeon was twiddlin' his thumbs. Finally had to
cancel/reschedule the op. They arranged their best for the
resched., he turned me into hamburger, finally got a sub-
clavian (blood all over the place). Now I assume nothing
whatsoever.
It's a piece-o-cake in a femoral vein, but most of 'em
cheerfully, cheerfully refuse to practice this valid piece
of medicine (unless I pre-arrange with the head of anesthesiology
or somesuch). Seems I asked my PM doc (an anesthesiologist) and
he refused, too, as best I recall.
Thanks to Nat,
Puddin'
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:29 am |
| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 16:35:21 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote something wonderfully witty:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 22:37:40 -0500, ZombyWoof <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net>
>wrote:
>
>
>I made a goof. I assumed "hard stick" was a recognized med
>term for "difficult to find a vein with the hypo". Difficult
>to draw blood or inject IV. My pcp has drawn blood from
>my femoral vein, but he hates to do it. Other docs and
>the blood lab places (i.e. idiot Quest) flatly refuse to try.
>
>-- SNIP --
>
Whoopise I was thinking along the lines of "So hard a cat can't
scratch it" if you know what I mean.
Ever hear the country comedy song "Dear Penis" done by Rodney
Carrington? Check it out at the following website for a minor chuckle
http://www.rodneycarrington.com/dearpenis.php
>
>I'm going to cut 1.) back to 2500 mg / day as an
>experiment. May have to toy with 2.) as well (but later).
>
>
>I'm thinking "how many docs would get very nervous when
>asked for a non-standard opiate compound?".
>
>
>Liver and testosterone tests are on my "ask" list as of now.
>
>I tested positive for Hep C *antigen* a couple years ago,
>and followed up with several blood tests, all of which
>indicated liver function was OK. The last test might've
>been a year ago.
>
>Stomach problems have been with me for years, but dad had
>'em (bad), and I've assumed it's genetic.
>
>I take about 1.5 drinks per day.
>
>
>Yeah, ya can't do that. Gotta stop, re-evaluate everything,
>make some changes. I've had similar difficulties years ago.
>
>
>I have less-than-perfect confidence in any of my docs. With
>all these years under my belt, I've learned to trust the med
>profession (in general) approximately as far as I can shot-
>put the Rock of Gibraltar. But I'll look into it.
>
>If anyone knows of a common no-apap opiate which is
>comparable to the "Vicodin" stuff for pain relief, I'm
>all ears ...
>
> Thanks,
> Puddin'
>
>
>
>******************************************************
>*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
>******************************************************;
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:29 am |
| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 18:00:56 GMT, natalya35@hotmail.com wrote
something wonderfully witty:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:20:46 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
>wrote:
>
>
>Speaking as one who is an almost impossible stick - before going in to
>have a blood draw, or anything else requiring a "stick", as long as
>you are not NPO before a procedure, hydrate yourself to the moon -
>drink, drink, drink - water, juice, all the fluids you can. It is
>amazing the difference this can make. Also, before a stick, let the
>"sticker" know and ask to have hot compresses put around your arms for
>a few minutes. This too can make even tiny, spidery veins "pop" long
>enough for the draw or IV or whatever. If the person doing the stick
>knows you are a difficult stick they can prepare with a smaller
>needle. I have had IV's using a 24, the size used on preemies, don't
>last long, and wouldn't be used for surgery, but can be enough to get
>some meds in you. Normal size for an adult is a 20, a believe. I know
>this isn't the problem you are addressing here, but thought you might
>find it useful should you unhappily find yourself needing an IV.
>Just some tricks I have learned over the years, Hawki might have some
>other suggestions to help prepare for a stick.
>
>Nat
>
Glad you knew what he was talking about. My mind was focused on the
testosterone issues. Since the hospital blew out my one decent vein
when I was in the hospital, they now use a baby stick with a line
attached to it that goes into the collection bottle. Then we wait,
and wait, and wait. After all the problems I've had with anemia I am
half-expecting dust to come out.
[vbcol=seagreen]
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:29 am |
| On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 00:40:44 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote something wonderfully witty:
>On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 18:00:56 GMT, natalya35@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>
>--- snip ---
>
>
>I'll try it ...
>
>
>I do find it potentially useful, and I very much appreciate
>your suggestions.
>
>
>I need all the tricks I can find ...
>
>Back in '96 I needed simple hernia (open) surgery, went in
>"cold" assuming the anesthesiologists could handle an IV. They
>assualted me with several "stickers", turned me into a pincussion
>whilst the po' surgeon was twiddlin' his thumbs. Finally had to
>cancel/reschedule the op. They arranged their best for the
>resched., he turned me into hamburger, finally got a sub-
>clavian (blood all over the place). Now I assume nothing
>whatsoever.
>
>It's a piece-o-cake in a femoral vein, but most of 'em
>cheerfully, cheerfully refuse to practice this valid piece
>of medicine (unless I pre-arrange with the head of anesthesiology
>or somesuch). Seems I asked my PM doc (an anesthesiologist) and
>he refused, too, as best I recall.
>
I have a really nice highly visible one on top of my foot. Any idea
of the pain that one causes. Still it is better then the back of the
hand.
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:29 am |
| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 13:10:46 -0800, LooseCannon
<lambchop.LC@gmail.com> wrote something wonderfully witty:
>Puddin' Man wrote:
>
>
>LOL, Id be THRILLED to just be at 2,3,4 times my original med dose to
>get relief! After decades of pain and pain meds, my tolerance is thru
>the roof.
>
I never realize exactly how high my tolerance level has gotten until
the other day in the middle of a massive pain flair I ended up taking
6 Vicodin ES's inside an hour two at a time. I might as well have
been eating M&M's for all the good they did.
My Last hospital ER visit I had three Morphine and two Dalaudid shots
within about an hour. Zip, Nada, nothing. About all that happened
was I started to relax from being clenched up from the pain.
Unbelievable. A Morphine shot may last me about 15 minutes after the
initial rush. It is now 200mg of Demoral to knock me out just so I
don't feel it. Sometimes they will throw in a little Versed to help
put me down when I have a really bad Migraine in order to sleep it
off.
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
|
| i'm getting there slowly thank god, not to be rude but it was a really
XXXXed up time, i thought about ending my life over it, seriously, thanks
for your thoughts, everyone here has mine to if you've gone through anything
near what i did...peace...joe
"IPGrunt" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns95E8ADFECEDBAswiss127army001wrenc@130.133.1.4...
> "xhead" <xhead@uwish.net> confessed in news:OLfJd.12622$HT6.2890@trnddc04:
>
it,[vbcol=seagreen]
> i
aound[vbcol=seagreen]
my[vbcol=seagreen]
and[vbcol=seagreen]
such[vbcol=seagreen]
> a
it...joe[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Sorry to hear this Joe,
>
> FWIW, many of us CPers have spent years searching in vain for adequate
pain
> treatment before finding the correct treatment and/or practitioner that
> brought relief and gave back our lives.
>
> I do hope you find what you need, soon, and get back the life you deserve.
>
> regards,
>
> -- ipgrunt
| |
|
| On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 00:40:44 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
wrote:
<snip for bandwidth>
>
>Back in '96 I needed simple hernia (open) surgery, went in
>"cold" assuming the anesthesiologists could handle an IV. They
>assualted me with several "stickers", turned me into a pincussion
>whilst the po' surgeon was twiddlin' his thumbs. Finally had to
>cancel/reschedule the op. They arranged their best for the
>resched., he turned me into hamburger, finally got a sub-
>clavian (blood all over the place). Now I assume nothing
>whatsoever.
>
>It's a piece-o-cake in a femoral vein, but most of 'em
>cheerfully, cheerfully refuse to practice this valid piece
>of medicine (unless I pre-arrange with the head of anesthesiology
>or somesuch). Seems I asked my PM doc (an anesthesiologist) and
>he refused, too, as best I recall.
>
I'm usually pretty easy, got great veins, and I bleed almost forever
(sometimes I can barely get the pinprick bleeding stopped when I take
my blood glucose) but the last time I was in for surgery I was either
tightened right up due to the stress or I had an anaesthetist that was
particularly bad with sticks but he tried over and over to get a line
into me. When I woke up my whole arm, both sides, was black and blue.
I'm glad they finally got one. I'd have hated to reschedule...
James
| |
|
| "Puddin' Man" <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in message
news:41f55e92.18175134@news.west.earthlink.net
> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 10:44:13 -0800, "Juba" <Juba@XmasterjubaX.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> Tolerance has always scared me. The idea of having to take
> 2, 3, 4 etc times the meds to achieve present level of
> pain relief sounds like a potential nightmare (at least for
> po' me).
It doesn't bother me to increase the dosage because I understand that
has to happen over time, but I do try to get by on the least amount
possible.
The only thing that scares me about that is an emergency situation like
the one og's friend went through. I think that's a real possibility and
it scares the hell out of me.
--
Juba
www.masterjuba.com
| |
|
| On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 16:44:37 -0500, Juba wrote
(in message <ct6ek2$rum$0@pita.alt.net> ):
>
> It doesn't bother me to increase the dosage because I understand that
> has to happen over time, but I do try to get by on the least amount
> possible.
>
> The only thing that scares me about that is an emergency situation like
> the one og's friend went through. I think that's a real possibility and
> it scares the hell out of me.
>
I think it scares us all. Has anyone ever come up with an ideal way to inform
ER personnel, etc. if there is no one present to speak for us in a situation
like og's friend went through?
The topic was discussed many moons ago, and the only thing that came up at
the time was to wear a MediAlert bracelet. I realize that life is more
important than an aversion to wearing an ugly bracelet, but would anyone
actually think to look at/for it in the first place?
Does anyone know if there is anything new for those of us who need to alert
medical personnel about medical problems when we can't speak for ourselves?
Annie
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:29 am |
| On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 23:48:17 GMT, Annie <annie@mindless.com> wrote
something wonderfully witty:
>On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 16:44:37 -0500, Juba wrote
>(in message <ct6ek2$rum$0@pita.alt.net> ):
>
>I think it scares us all. Has anyone ever come up with an ideal way to inform
>ER personnel, etc. if there is no one present to speak for us in a situation
>like og's friend went through?
>
>The topic was discussed many moons ago, and the only thing that came up at
>the time was to wear a MediAlert bracelet. I realize that life is more
>important than an aversion to wearing an ugly bracelet, but would anyone
>actually think to look at/for it in the first place?
>
>Does anyone know if there is anything new for those of us who need to alert
>medical personnel about medical problems when we can't speak for ourselves?
>
>Annie
>
As I said in another post I have a list of meds, a note from my
Doctor, and a medical directive in my wallet. If you can't speak for
yourself they usually go through your wallet looking for contact
information. If anyone was to open my wallet they couldn't miss the
afore mentioned items. I also still wear my Dog-tags with my blood
type & allergy (PCN) on them. Perhaps I should have them stamped "See
Wallet".
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
|
| natalya35@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> Speaking as one who is an almost impossible stick - before going in to
> have a blood draw, or anything else requiring a "stick", as long as
> you are not NPO before a procedure, hydrate yourself to the moon -
> drink, drink, drink - water, juice, all the fluids you can. It is
> amazing the difference this can make. Also, before a stick, let the
> "sticker" know and ask to have hot compresses put around your arms for
> a few minutes. This too can make even tiny, spidery veins "pop" long
> enough for the draw or IV or whatever. If the person doing the stick
> knows you are a difficult stick they can prepare with a smaller
> needle. I have had IV's using a 24, the size used on preemies, don't
> last long, and wouldn't be used for surgery, but can be enough to get
> some meds in you. Normal size for an adult is a 20, a believe. I know
> this isn't the problem you are addressing here, but thought you might
> find it useful should you unhappily find yourself needing an IV.
> Just some tricks I have learned over the years, Hawki might have some
> other suggestions to help prepare for a stick.
I didn't know all of that, thanks for passing it on!
I always thought my veins were good for IVs etc, because you can see them so
clearly, but apparently it's just because of my skin being transcluscent,
not that my veins are easy to get to!
After my back op when putting in an IV for a blood transfusion, a nurse took
one look at my arm and then went and got someone more experienced. Who then
took about three goes to manage it! And that was after some idiot tried to
put a blood transfusion through an IV in the other arm that'd been there for
two days, and collapsed the vein (I assume that's what the incredible
burning sensation was which made me scream for them to stop...)
--
Katharine
Never buy a car you can't push.
| |
|
| On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 21:49:00 -0500, ZombyWoof wrote
(in message <p31ev0lrvkgrdkhurepc187nqob7vapd34@4ax.com> ):
> As I said in another post I have a list of meds, a note from my
> Doctor, and a medical directive in my wallet. If you can't speak for
> yourself they usually go through your wallet looking for contact
> information. If anyone was to open my wallet they couldn't miss the
> afore mentioned items. I also still wear my Dog-tags with my blood
> type & allergy (PCN) on them. Perhaps I should have them stamped "See
> Wallet".
>
Great idea, Zomby!
Maybe I'll have some dogtags made especially for me: platinum with a few
diamonds and sapphires thrown in with a platinum chain. (May as well go all
the way and get the best.) Oh wait. I think I have actually seen some dogtag
jewelry somewhere . . . maybe in a Neiman-Marcus catalog? Anyway it's an
option if I had the money. Perhaps I could have them made with something less
expensive though.
I have never thought about dogtags and must have missed (or not remembered)
your post talking about them.
Annie
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:30 am |
| On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 23:26:38 +1100, "Kath"
<kathnews2@optusnet.ieatspam.com.au.dud> wrote something wonderfully
witty:
>natalya35@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>
>I didn't know all of that, thanks for passing it on!
>
>I always thought my veins were good for IVs etc, because you can see them so
>clearly, but apparently it's just because of my skin being transcluscent,
>not that my veins are easy to get to!
>
Your translucent? Like those kit models of the see-thru man? Damn
that is bizarre. Bet you need to wear like SPF 1,000,000 at the
beach. 
>After my back op when putting in an IV for a blood transfusion, a nurse took
>one look at my arm and then went and got someone more experienced. Who then
>took about three goes to manage it! And that was after some idiot tried to
>put a blood transfusion through an IV in the other arm that'd been there for
>two days, and collapsed the vein (I assume that's what the incredible
>burning sensation was which made me scream for them to stop...)
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:30 am |
| On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 14:57:39 -0600, Toto <notme@nowhere.net> wrote:
>On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 00:40:44 GMT, Pudding.Man@Gmail.com (Puddin' Man)
>wrote:
>
><snip for bandwidth>
>
>I'm usually pretty easy, got great veins, and I bleed almost forever
>(sometimes I can barely get the pinprick bleeding stopped when I take
>my blood glucose) but the last time I was in for surgery I was either
>tightened right up due to the stress
Seems stress would've upped your blood pressure, maybe made
the stick a little easier ...
>or I had an anaesthetist that was
>particularly bad with sticks but he tried over and over to get a line
>into me. When I woke up my whole arm, both sides, was black and blue.
>I'm glad they finally got one. I'd have hated to reschedule...
The resched. is a serious, serious pain in the arse for
everybody involved.
I'd have to guess your sticker was a semi-competent. There
are some very competent folks out there, but the industry
seems to be teaching/enforcing assembly-line medical practice.
If you don't fit their standard form-factor ...
Puddin'
>James
>
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| Puddin' Man 2005-01-27, 7:30 am |
| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 22:50:06 GMT, "old goat"
<oldgoatmailatyahoodotcom@ERdocs.suk> wrote:
>Dear Puddin,
>
>It's easy to remember somebody that was looking at the same block(G/F) that
>scared the livin daylights out you, too. I did 6 of them so-and-so's,
>before it hit with any kind of help, and then it was the permanent type, so
>it also counts as a medical win in my book which makes it memorable, too.
I am very, very glad that it worked for you. And hope it continues
to do so.
>Definitely get complete bloodwork done up, looking for liver and kidney and
>other systemic damages, cause I hate to say it to you but the max number on
>the Ibuprofen was lower than the acetaminophen. They got to have something
>more effective as an anti inflammatory than the OTC stuff with less overall
>risk to the rest of you. I was the same way too with the hydrocodone being
>wayy better for me than the oxycodone, but you're going to have to find a
>special pharmacy where they mix up their own medications(compounding) to
>get straight HC.
I dunno if that's practical for po' me, but I'll look
into it.
>Strange they just skip right over it on the "ladder of strength" but it
>shows just how little they know about everyone getting better results with
>this or that. Oxy will make a good replacement but it takes time to get
>used to it or even a little dose of methadone would probably knock the pain
>out all day long. You need a doc willing to try some new stuff, a minor bit
>of serious pain reliever and a stronger anti inflammatory without the side
>effects(although damn near all of the have some to one degree or another.)
>sounds like what you're looking for. But get away from that ibuprophen/APAP
>fast as you can. And the blood work!!
I'm working on scaling both the apap and the ibu. back a bit.
The rest will have to wait for a while ...
Best,
Puddin'
[vbcol=seagreen]
>Puddin' Man <Pudding.Man@Gmail.com> wrote in article
><41f4189f.21374364@news.west.earthlink.net>...
>conservative
>from
>damage
>long
>some
>of
******************************************************
*** Puddin' Man PuddingDotMan at GmailDotCom ***
******************************************************;
| |
| LooseCannon 2005-01-27, 7:30 am |
| ZombyWoof wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 23:26:38 +1100, "Kath"
> <kathnews2@optusnet.ieatspam.com.au.dud> wrote something wonderfully
> witty:
>
>
>
> Your translucent? Like those kit models of the see-thru man? Damn
> that is bizarre. Bet you need to wear like SPF 1,000,000 at the
> beach.
Nope, the model kits are transparent. Transclucent is where light shows
thru, but ya cant see clearly.
>
>
>
>
| |
|
| "Annie" <annie@mindless.com> wrote in message
news:0001HW.BE1C44F0006BE5AAF02845B0@netnews.mchsi.com
> On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 16:44:37 -0500, Juba wrote
> (in message <ct6ek2$rum$0@pita.alt.net> ):
>
> I think it scares us all. Has anyone ever come up with an ideal way
> to inform ER personnel, etc. if there is no one present to speak for
> us in a situation like og's friend went through?
>
> The topic was discussed many moons ago, and the only thing that came
> up at the time was to wear a MediAlert bracelet. I realize that life
> is more important than an aversion to wearing an ugly bracelet, but
> would anyone actually think to look at/for it in the first place?
>
> Does anyone know if there is anything new for those of us who need to
> alert medical personnel about medical problems when we can't speak
> for ourselves?
>
> Annie
They are expermenting with an implantable chip right now, but Medic
Alert is about the best there is till the chips are perfected and the
privacy issues are resolved. A good interim step would be a Medic Alert
badge with a chip on it.
--
Juba
www.masterjuba.com
| |
|
| ZombyWoof wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 23:26:38 +1100, "Kath"
> Your translucent? Like those kit models of the see-thru man? Damn
> that is bizarre. Bet you need to wear like SPF 1,000,000 at the
> beach.
<grin> not *that* translucent!
But yeah, I have quite fair skin, and in a lot of places you can clearly see
all the veins. If I used a texta to mark them all I'd look like a tree! It's
amazing I don't look blue as it is, I'm just fairly pale.
--
Katharine
People do not get sick from cold weather; it's from being indoors a lot
more and therefore being in contact with more germs in the air.
| |
|
| IPGrunt wrote:
> "Kath" <kathnews2@optusnet.ieatspam.com.au.dud> confessed in
>
> The Invisible Woman?
LOL apparently
--
Katharine
Plan to be spontaneous tomorrow.
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:31 am |
| On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 14:12:25 GMT, Annie <annie@mindless.com> wrote
something wonderfully witty:
>On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 21:49:00 -0500, ZombyWoof wrote
>(in message <p31ev0lrvkgrdkhurepc187nqob7vapd34@4ax.com> ):
>
>
>
>Great idea, Zomby!
>
>Maybe I'll have some dogtags made especially for me: platinum with a few
>diamonds and sapphires thrown in with a platinum chain. (May as well go all
>the way and get the best.) Oh wait. I think I have actually seen some dogtag
>jewelry somewhere . . . maybe in a Neiman-Marcus catalog? Anyway it's an
>option if I had the money. Perhaps I could have them made with something less
>expensive though.
>
Go into a hospital around here with one of those babies while not
being in a condition to communicate and I can pretty much promise you
you're not coming back out with it. Hell they might pull the plug on
you just to be able to get away with taking it.
Do I sound jaded? Nah, not me.
>I have never thought about dogtags and must have missed (or not remembered)
>your post talking about them.
>
>Annie
>
>
>
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
| ZombyWoof 2005-01-27, 7:31 am |
| On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 13:38:14 -0800, LooseCannon
<lambchop.LC@gmail.com> wrote something wonderfully witty:
>ZombyWoof wrote:
>
>
>Nope, the model kits are transparent. Transclucent is where light shows
>thru, but ya cant see clearly.
>
Nope, I set you up and you missed a golden opportunity. It is Juba
that is transparent. I need to get me a better straight man.[vbcol=seagreen]
--
"patients who undertake opioid maintenance therapy
should behave in a way that is beyond reproach or
suspicion in all matters relating to their use of
medications. Patients who are unwilling or unable
to do so jeopardize not only their own health and
safety, but the health and safety of other patients
with chronic pain." -- Dr. Hurwitz
| |
|
| "ZombyWoof" <Zomby-Woof@Zappa.net> wrote in message
news:nvogv0di71mir8dustp1nsfnponku2igfa@4ax.com
> On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 13:38:14 -0800, LooseCannon
> <lambchop.LC@gmail.com> wrote something wonderfully witty:
> Nope, I set you up and you missed a golden opportunity. It is Juba
> that is transparent. I need to get me a better straight man.
Perhaps he decided not to sully a support thread with a personal attack?
Ironic that you would, considering your comments on that very thing just
a couple of days ago.
--
Juba
www.masterjuba.com
| |
| Annie 2005-01-31, 11:18 am |
| On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 22:44:55 -0500, ZombyWoof wrote
(in message <qpogv01sj2j9pdu794eifko27blhv9h02a@4ax.com> ):
<<snipped>>
> Go into a hospital around here with one of those babies while not
> being in a condition to communicate and I can pretty much promise you
> you're not coming back out with it. Hell they might pull the plug on
> you just to be able to get away with taking it.
>
> Do I sound jaded? Nah, not me.
Geez! Where is my brain? You have a point. I forgot that I have always been
told to leave even my wedding ring at home when having surgery. Of course, my
joints have swollen so much now that no one could get it off with a crowbar.
That's something I need to take care of before I injure my ring finger or my
left hand which could be very, very painful to say the least.
|
| |
|
|