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| Mark Warner brings up the subject of Free Will.
****************************************************************8
This debate about Free will has been around a long time in Christian
circles. My self I think we are born with a "sin nature". Born under a
curse you might say. We do NOT have a "choice"(free will in a sense)
about the nature we inherit.We are slaves to sin. Our " Choice" so to
speak is to seek out salvation from the choice of Adam and the nature
we inherit. When we find the grace of God we are given a new nature
(born again) and the power to live righteously. Thats the best I can
explain it.
Nobody chooses to sin.That choice was used up by Adam.
http://livingtheology.com/FreeWill.htm
***********************************************************
So you say you have free will. Then you are free to stop sining and you
have no compulsions at all. But your not are you? Where is the free
will if you have a compulsion?
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| Roger G. 2005-09-23, 12:08 pm |
|
"tedw" <tedw2@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1127079705.528939.308780@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Mark Warner brings up the subject of Free Will.
> ****************************************************************8
>
>
> This debate about Free will has been around a long time in Christian
> circles. My self I think we are born with a "sin nature". Born under a
> curse you might say. We do NOT have a "choice"(free will in a sense)
> about the nature we inherit.We are slaves to sin. Our " Choice" so to
> speak is to seek out salvation from the choice of Adam and the nature
> we inherit. When we find the grace of God we are given a new nature
> (born again) and the power to live righteously. Thats the best I can
> explain it.
>
> Nobody chooses to sin.That choice was used up by Adam.
>
>
> http://livingtheology.com/FreeWill.htm
>
> ***********************************************************
>
> So you say you have free will. Then you are free to stop sining and you
> have no compulsions at all. But your not are you? Where is the free
> will if you have a compulsion?
"If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice"
"Free Will" by Rush
| |
| ByTor 2005-09-23, 12:08 pm |
| In article <6pmXe.513337$s54.124062@pd7tw2no>, rogermg@shaw.ca, Roger
G. says...
> "If you choose not to decide
> You still have made a choice"
>
> "Free Will" by Rush
>
>
>
Most excellent quote/song............ ;0)
| |
| ByTor 2005-09-23, 12:08 pm |
| In article <1127079705.528939.308780@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
tedw2@earthlink.net, tedw says...
>
> Nobody chooses to sin.That choice was used up by Adam.
Here we go again, time to feed the monkey..............
| |
|
| ByTor wrote:
> In article <1127079705.528939.308780@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> tedw2@earthlink.net, tedw says...
>
>
>
>
> Here we go again, time to feed the monkey..............
Or spank him. ;)
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| ByTor 2005-09-23, 12:08 pm |
| In article <O_mXe.9762$zG1.4136@trnddc05>, connectu2@verizon.net, F.H.
says...
> ByTor wrote:
>
> Or spank him. ;)
>
>
That too........ ;0)
| |
|
| tedw wrote:
> Mark Warner brings up the subject of Free Will.
> ****************************************************************8
>
>
> This debate about Free will has been around a long time in Christian
> circles. My self I think we are born with a "sin nature". Born under a
> curse you might say. We do NOT have a "choice"(free will in a sense)
> about the nature we inherit.We are slaves to sin. Our " Choice" so to
> speak is to seek out salvation from the choice of Adam and the nature
> we inherit. When we find the grace of God we are given a new nature
> (born again) and the power to live righteously. Thats the best I can
> explain it.
>
> Nobody chooses to sin.That choice was used up by Adam.
>
>
> http://livingtheology.com/FreeWill.htm
>
> ***********************************************************
>
> So you say you have free will. Then you are free to stop sining and you
> have no compulsions at all. But your not are you? Where is the free
> will if you have a compulsion?
>
What does "sin" mean? How do you define it?
John
| |
|
| Good question. I dont know if Im adequate to the task.Its not a word
used a lot in everyday America is it.
The best place to look for that is the Holy Scripture, but I will try.
I have heard sin described as rebellion against God. Its also doubt and
disobedience to the will of the creator. It is tresspassing the
commandments. It is also hatred of ones neighbor. I believe scriptures
say all unrighteousness is sin. Sin has also been defined as "mssing
the mark", The seven dealy sins is a fairly well recognized list:
Pride
Greed
Envy
Anger
Lust
Gluttony
Sloth
and yes, included homosexuality in the list.
| |
| ByTor 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
| In article <1127109165.920329.232810@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
tedw2@earthlink.net, tedw says...
> Good question. I dont know if Im adequate to the task.
And yet you persistantly go on & on about it? Why don't you find a hobby
or something? I hear sock puppeting is a good avenue for releasing
"useless" energy.
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| GaryE 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
| On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 04:33:25 GMT, John <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote:
>What does "sin" mean? How do you define it?
>John
I read once that it literally means 'error'. In other words, Adam and
Steve, errr...Adam and Eve with error free. (This requires an
assumption that with a woman around, a man could actually be error
free.) Then *they* made the error of not listening to The Creator and
having a snack of apples on the Old Man's Apple Tree (which he planted
there because....because....) Fortunately, and unbeknownst to most,
when The Crator did the Universe, he did a forked Universe, multiple
universes. Every possible result could then be accomplished and we
just happen to be in the one universe where this one error was made.
The Creator has since moved on to the universe where the error wasn't
made and he is, of course, well pleased.
The Yankees will have to play sin free if they expect to make the
World Series this year.
Best,
GaryE
| |
|
| tedw wrote:
> Good question. I dont know if Im adequate to the task.Its not a word
> used a lot in everyday America is it.
> The best place to look for that is the Holy Scripture, but I will try.
>
> I have heard sin described as rebellion against God. Its also doubt and
> disobedience to the will of the creator. It is tresspassing the
> commandments. It is also hatred of ones neighbor. I believe scriptures
> say all unrighteousness is sin. Sin has also been defined as "mssing
> the mark", The seven dealy sins is a fairly well recognized list:
>
> Pride
> Greed
> Envy
> Anger
> Lust
> Gluttony
> Sloth
>
> and yes, included homosexuality in the list.
>
Actually homosexuality isn't included until YOU add it.
John
| |
|
| tedw wrote:
> Good question. I dont know if Im adequate to the task.Its not a word
> used a lot in everyday America is it.
> The best place to look for that is the Holy Scripture, but I will try.
>
> I have heard sin described as rebellion against God. Its also doubt and
> disobedience to the will of the creator. It is tresspassing the
> commandments. It is also hatred of ones neighbor. I believe scriptures
> say all unrighteousness is sin. Sin has also been defined as "mssing
> the mark", The seven dealy sins is a fairly well recognized list:
>
> Pride
> Greed
> Envy
> Anger
> Lust
> Gluttony
> Sloth
>
> and yes, included homosexuality in the list.
>
I understand "sin" to mean being human. Only the human being blushes,
has a sense a shame or has a sense of "am I good or bad?" Human being is
only animal that evaluates itself on other than useful grounds.
Useful = did I (or you) catch and eat that thing?
Non Useful = was I (or you) a good boy when I (or you) caught and ate
that thing.
Only human beings worry about whether they are good or bad. That is what
sin refers to.
IMHO of course
John
| |
| nipntuk 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
| On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 07:03:38 -0500, GaryE <garyexxxxxxx@swbell.net>
wrote:
>On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 04:33:25 GMT, John <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>I read once that it literally means 'error'. In other words, Adam and
>Steve, errr...Adam and Eve with error free. (This requires an
>assumption that with a woman around, a man could actually be error
>free.) Then *they* made the error of not listening to The Creator and
>having a snack of apples on the Old Man's Apple Tree (which he planted
>there because....because....) Fortunately, and unbeknownst to most,
>when The Crator did the Universe, he did a forked Universe, multiple
>universes. Every possible result could then be accomplished and we
>just happen to be in the one universe where this one error was made.
>The Creator has since moved on to the universe where the error wasn't
>made and he is, of course, well pleased.
>
>The Yankees will have to play sin free if they expect to make the
>World Series this year.
>
>Best,
>GaryE
I can't tell you how often this stOOpid computer of mine has sinned.
I got the blue screen of death not long ago, reporting a 'fatal sin'
- and then, the dreaded stack dump before everything went black.
The sin appeared to be related to a bad USB driver trying to covet the
resources needed by it's neighboring hardware. I made contact with a
Higher Power, and the corruption has been forgiven. My 'puter is
redeemed.
------------------------------
Visit http://www.nacer.org for the real 'Survivor Yucatan'
| |
| Sharx35 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
|
"John" <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:51AXe.138638$084.126055@attbi_s22...
> tedw wrote:
> Actually homosexuality isn't included until YOU add it.
It falls under lust.
>
> John
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| Ron G 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
|
"Sharx35" <sharx35@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8WMXe.248260$HI.43427@edtnps84...
>
> "John" <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote in message
> news:51AXe.138638$084.126055@attbi_s22...
>
> It falls under lust.
>
How so? Are you saying that anyone who is a homosexual is lustful by virture
of being a homosexual?
RonG
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| Sharx35 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
|
"Ron G" <ron@network12.com> wrote in message
news:wANXe.120850$Ep.5787@lakeread02...
>
> "Sharx35" <sharx35@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:8WMXe.248260$HI.43427@edtnps84...
> How so? Are you saying that anyone who is a homosexual is lustful by
> virture of being a homosexual?
>
> RonG
Beats me! Ask some of the LIEbrawl fag apologists!
>
>
| |
| Craig S. 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
| "Sharx35" <sharx35@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5VOXe.267437$tt5.54491@edtnps90...
> Beats me! Ask some of the LIEbrawl fag apologists!
Now where's Stuart when we really need him?!
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| Kai Ruuska 2005-09-23, 12:09 pm |
| Craig S. kirjoitti:
> "Sharx35" <sharx35@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:5VOXe.267437$tt5.54491@edtnps90...
>
>
>
> Now where's Stuart when we really need him?!
>
Stuart's not a liberal.
--
Kai
"Always be yourself. Unless you suck."
| |
|
| Sharx35 wrote:
> "John" <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote in message
> news:51AXe.138638$084.126055@attbi_s22...
>
>
>
> It falls under lust.
>
>
>
>
>
What's the difference between lust, a sin, and healthy horny, a nature
of mankind?
John
John
| |
|
| Sharx35 wrote:
> "John" <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote in message
> news:51AXe.138638$084.126055@attbi_s22...
>
>
>
> It falls under lust.
>
>
>
>
>
What's the difference between Pride, a sin, and good self esteem?
What's the difference between Greed, a sin, and working and saving to
provide for your future?
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| stuart 2005-09-26, 4:46 pm |
|
Sharx35 <sharx35@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8WMXe.248260$HI.43427@edtnps84...
>
> "John" <John6328@mchsi.com> wrote in message
> news:51AXe.138638$084.126055@attbi_s22...
>
> It falls under lust.
Where does heterosexuality fall, John?
>
>
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