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Home > Archive > Schizophrenia Support > November 2004 > play my pipe organ
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play my pipe organ
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| TohuVohu 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| i've always wanted an organ, preferably pipe organ or electronic type. i have
played a bit of the piano, i can pick my way through sonatas. i can't play
Philip Glass at this point, since it's too technically demanding.
i may take some violin lessons when time permits i.e. after i get a job.
i dunno if i want to compose music or even play it, but i want to experiment
with some ideas. certainly i want to learn the theory, esp of New Music. i've
been listening to all sorts of genres for over 10 years, so it's high time to
learn music theory. i also like film, and with my video background, it would
be easier than music.
michael
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| Yasunari 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| Remember that time, on 18 Nov 2004 18:56:38 GMT, tohuvohu@aol.com
(TohuVohu) had prophecied:
>i've always wanted an organ, preferably pipe organ or electronic type. i have
>played a bit of the piano, i can pick my way through sonatas. i can't play
>Philip Glass at this point, since it's too technically demanding.
>
>i may take some violin lessons when time permits i.e. after i get a job.
>
>i dunno if i want to compose music or even play it, but i want to experiment
>with some ideas. certainly i want to learn the theory, esp of New Music. i've
>been listening to all sorts of genres for over 10 years, so it's high time to
>learn music theory. i also like film, and with my video background, it would
>be easier than music.
>
>michael
if i knew you were nearby, i would let you borrow a keyboard. i love
synths, and my room is spilling over with them. id love to have an
organ, especially with pedals.
thats great if you can pick through a sonata. i cant really perform
any standard piece of music, but i can make up something i enjoy.
philip glass' music is nice. i saw him three times: once playing solo
piano at UCLA, he did the metamorphoses and did Witchita Sutra Vortex;
i saw him perform live with the Kronos Quartet as they scored Dracula,
and then i was at one of his symphonies. he was there only as a guest
that time.
one of my favourite pieces is Contrary Motion. it makes me feel
really good. i imagine i cat falling from the sky in slow motion for
the whole 16 minute piece.
i hope you find a synth or organ.
"Alone With The Voice."
[Folk-Telemetry]
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"TohuVohu" <tohuvohu@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20041118135638.11861.00000752@mb-m16.aol.com...
> i've always wanted an organ, preferably pipe organ or electronic type. i
have
> played a bit of the piano, i can pick my way through sonatas. i can't
play
> Philip Glass at this point, since it's too technically demanding.
>
> i may take some violin lessons when time permits i.e. after i get a job.
>
> i dunno if i want to compose music or even play it, but i want to
experiment
> with some ideas. certainly i want to learn the theory, esp of New Music.
i've
> been listening to all sorts of genres for over 10 years, so it's high time
to
> learn music theory. i also like film, and with my video background, it
would
> be easier than music.
>
> michael
A word of warning - I studied music right to university level, and it did
reach a stage where the more I studied it, the less I enjoyed it. Music is
such a FANTASTIC thing and I quit! Even though I made it to a teacher
level, I preferred to quit music altogether as a profession rather than lose
the wonder and enjoyment of music for the sake of music.
Being like Damo and just performing is wonderful - but actually studying
technique, harmony, composition and things like that, you would be amazed at
just how much less you can enjoy a piece of Bach once you have studied
things like counterpoint and consecutives.
Maybe Ioannis does not agree - I would like to hear his point of view on
this.
Michelle
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| Cymbal Man Freq. 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| Lip-Syncing can be dangerous if somebody else washes their hair in the sink
after you're done.
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| Ioannis 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| Hood wrote:
> "TohuVohu" <tohuvohu@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20041118135638.11861.00000752@mb-m16.aol.com...
>
>
> have
>
>
> play
>
>
> experiment
>
>
> i've
>
>
> to
>
>
> would
>
>
>
> A word of warning - I studied music right to university level, and it did
> reach a stage where the more I studied it, the less I enjoyed it. Music is
> such a FANTASTIC thing and I quit! Even though I made it to a teacher
> level, I preferred to quit music altogether as a profession rather than lose
> the wonder and enjoyment of music for the sake of music.
>
> Being like Damo and just performing is wonderful - but actually studying
> technique, harmony, composition and things like that, you would be amazed at
> just how much less you can enjoy a piece of Bach once you have studied
> things like counterpoint and consecutives.
>
> Maybe Ioannis does not agree - I would like to hear his point of view on
> this.
Studying technique is ok for me. Studying harmony, composition,
counterpoint, fugue and the rest, simply increases the importance of the
great composers (and most notably Bach) for me. That really humbles the
ego, so it follows that it is good. I have observed no decrease in
enjoynment for me, from studying some such things, probably because I
still have no idea how the great composers applied all that.
> Michelle
--
I. N. G. --- http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/
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"Ioannis" <morpheus@olympus.mons> wrote in message
news:1100860862.15786@athnrd02...
> Studying technique is ok for me. Studying harmony, composition,
> counterpoint, fugue and the rest, simply increases the importance of the
> great composers (and most notably Bach) for me. That really humbles the
> ego, so it follows that it is good. I have observed no decrease in
> enjoynment for me, from studying some such things, probably because I
> still have no idea how the great composers applied all that.
>
When I studied music (not just keyboards) I had to learn to write "in the
style of Bach" or "in the style of Mozart" etc and get to know what
techniques they used for modulation/counterpoint etc.
It's just that I would rather say (on listening to a piece of Bach) "Wow
that sounds nice" rather than "what an incredible modulation, and mark how
he uses the dominant of the next key prior to the leading seventh" (or
similar, I can't really remember) and once I started hearing some of the
"rules" and how the great composers applied them, then the beauty of it
almost started to become secondary to the technique.
As for keyboards and playing - that is still a main pleasure. I once played
Vidor's Toccata and Bach's Prelude and Fugue in D minor on a real Church
organ - I think it was a Cathedral actually, anyhow, it was some huge place.
WOW! That was something.
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| Ioannis 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| Hood wrote:
[snip]
> When I studied music (not just keyboards) I had to learn to write "in the
> style of Bach" or "in the style of Mozart" etc and get to know what
> techniques they used for modulation/counterpoint etc.
Is this "in the style of Bach" enough for you? :-)
http://www.virtualcomposer2000.com/MP3/Fugue999.html
> It's just that I would rather say (on listening to a piece of Bach) "Wow
> that sounds nice" rather than "what an incredible modulation, and mark how
> he uses the dominant of the next key prior to the leading seventh" (or
> similar, I can't really remember) and once I started hearing some of the
> "rules" and how the great composers applied them, then the beauty of it
> almost started to become secondary to the technique.
>
> As for keyboards and playing - that is still a main pleasure. I once played
> Vidor's Toccata and Bach's Prelude and Fugue in D minor on a real Church
> organ - I think it was a Cathedral actually, anyhow, it was some huge place.
> WOW! That was something.
Here's smore Bach for ya, played last year. The second link is prelude
BWV 999, for which I wrote the fugue above, on a competition by pianist
Tjako van Schie.
Little Prelude #6 from the collection of little preludes and fuges:
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/LittleP6.html
Lute Prelude BWV 999:
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/LuteP.html
Prelude & Fugue #2 from the Well Tempered Clavier, Book II.
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/P_FII.html
And a little Beethoven excerpt while I was a grad student at UIC, from
the Waldstein sonata:
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/Waldstein.html
All the links are redirection links to .mp3 files, so you'll have to
wait for them to load, before they play.
--
I. N. G. --- http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/
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"Ioannis" <morpheus@olympus.mons> wrote in message
news:1100878582.912196@athnrd02...
> Hood wrote:
> [snip]
the[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Is this "in the style of Bach" enough for you? :-)
>
> http://www.virtualcomposer2000.com/MP3/Fugue999.html
>
how[vbcol=seagreen]
played[vbcol=seagreen]
place.[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Here's smore Bach for ya, played last year. The second link is prelude
> BWV 999, for which I wrote the fugue above, on a competition by pianist
> Tjako van Schie.
>
> Little Prelude #6 from the collection of little preludes and fuges:
> http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/LittleP6.html
>
> Lute Prelude BWV 999:
> http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/LuteP.html
>
> Prelude & Fugue #2 from the Well Tempered Clavier, Book II.
> http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/P_FII.html
>
> And a little Beethoven excerpt while I was a grad student at UIC, from
> the Waldstein sonata:
> http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/music/Waldstein.html
>
> All the links are redirection links to .mp3 files, so you'll have to
> wait for them to load, before they play.
> --
> I. N. G. --- http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/
>
When I say write in the style of Bach, Ioannis (just to clarify) I mean sit
down with a pen and paper, no keyboard, just score the notes on manuscript
paper completely from technique and without any access to hearing them (or
hearing them only in my head).
If you create pieces by sitting at a keyboard, great THAT'S THE WAY TO DO IT
and that is the best way, but if you have written these pieces WITHOUT
access to hearing them, and purely with a pen and manuscript paper, purely
by knowing the "rules" then that is a different question altogether.
Could you let me know this please before I listen to these pieces?
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| Ioannis 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| Hood wrote:
[snip]
> When I say write in the style of Bach, Ioannis (just to clarify) I mean sit
> down with a pen and paper, no keyboard, just score the notes on manuscript
> paper completely from technique and without any access to hearing them (or
> hearing them only in my head).
Sitting down and composing "with pen and paper" is an obsolete process.
Most modern composers compose using sequencers today, and if sequencers
were available in Bach's time, even Bach himself would use one. Harmony
exercises with pen and paper are one thing, composing another. Nobody
expects modern students or composers to "compose" using pen and paper
anymore. I have solved harmony exercises and they were fun. Some were
even pretty. But "composing" using pen and paper works of the greatness
of the big ones, you'd HAVE to be one of them. You might try to compose,
say, a fugue, on a sequencer program and tell me how easy/hard it is.
> If you create pieces by sitting at a keyboard, great THAT'S THE WAY TO DO IT
> and that is the best way, but if you have written these pieces WITHOUT
> access to hearing them, and purely with a pen and manuscript paper, purely
> by knowing the "rules" then that is a different question altogether.
>
> Could you let me know this please before I listen to these pieces?
The only piece composed using a sequencer is the fugue. The rest are
live performances.
--
I. N. G. --- http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/
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"Ioannis" <morpheus@olympus.mons> wrote in message
news:1100880677.472684@athnrd02...
> Hood wrote:
>
> [snip]
sit[vbcol=seagreen]
manuscript[vbcol=seagreen]
(or[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Sitting down and composing "with pen and paper" is an obsolete process.
> Most modern composers compose using sequencers today, and if sequencers
> were available in Bach's time, even Bach himself would use one. Harmony
> exercises with pen and paper are one thing, composing another. Nobody
> expects modern students or composers to "compose" using pen and paper
> anymore. I have solved harmony exercises and they were fun. Some were
> even pretty. But "composing" using pen and paper works of the greatness
> of the big ones, you'd HAVE to be one of them. You might try to compose,
> say, a fugue, on a sequencer program and tell me how easy/hard it is.
>
DO IT[vbcol=seagreen]
purely[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> The only piece composed using a sequencer is the fugue. The rest are
> live performances.
> --
> I. N. G. --- http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/
You must remember that I did this for a university degree - it was a test of
intelligence as well as that of composition, rather like doing Maths without
the aid of a calculator.
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| Ioannis 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| Hood wrote:
[snip]
> You must remember that I did this for a university degree - it was a test of
> intelligence as well as that of composition, rather like doing Maths without
> the aid of a calculator.
All the more reason for you to appreciate a good fugue, which was
written without the author *consciously* employing any harmony rules,
but which turned out to _be_ there, after the fugue was completed,
nevertheless.
Focus on *not consciously* and _maybe_ you will get the right idea.
Maybe then you'll also understand why I wrote only ONE such fugue and
then stopped.
--
I. N. G. --- http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/
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| TohuVohu 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| >Studying technique is ok for me. Studying harmony, composition,
>counterpoint, fugue and the rest, simply increases the importance of the
>great composers (and most notably Bach) for me. That really humbles the
>ego, so it follows that it is good. I have observed no decrease in
>enjoynment for me, from studying some such things, probably because I
>still have no idea how the great composers applied all that.
i would rather deconstruct something than enjoy it on a subconcious level.
that's how an analytical mind works. the joy is in the deconstruction, not the
whole.
this is why i'm picky about loudspeakers and amps. the timbre of the speakers
is as important to me as the performance, although i'm less of an audiophool
than i was previously.
michael
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| TohuVohu 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| >Studying technique is ok for me. Studying harmony, composition,
>counterpoint, fugue and the rest, simply increases the importance of the
>great composers (and most notably Bach) for me.
Godel, Escher, and Bach was a read that increased my admiration of high baroque
fugues, etc. because i don't play or compose music particularly well, it's
magic to me. even after learning a bit of the theory, it's still magic. much
as i understand college-level physics, but Feyman is still magical.
i do understand some of the nitty-gritty details of frequency, which would help
me in low-level soundscape composition. certainly the traditional western
non-microtonal scale is simply determined by an octave separated into twelve
parts i.e. twelth root. now that we are past the consonance hoopla, we can
focus on interaction of frequencies without fear of dissonance. unless you
play country-and-western. ;-)
michael
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| TohuVohu 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| >played
>Vidor's Toccata
Widor?
i have a Chandos recording of Widor, Poulenc and someone else. i once thought
it was New Music, but it's actually pretty mainstream to me after exploring the
avant garde.
Bach however was never alien to my ears, and i related well to his mathematical
precision. thing is Bach is too clean, too neat for listening moods, so i
prefer something with less structure, or more aptly, less apparent structure.
Schoenberg, Bach, and Glass are all fit different moods (for me at least).
michael
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| TohuVohu 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| >You must remember that I did this for a university degree - it was a test of
>intelligence as well as that of composition, rather like doing Maths without
>the aid of a calculator.
yes, this is much like learning to differentiate the long, obtuse way just to
demonstrate the core fundamentals of the process. however, of course, we use
calculators and Mathematica after that (in the nineties at least). i learned
the long way for speaker design, and often prefer a combination of
pen-and-paper design as well as simulation software. the problem with
simulation software is that every single variable cannot be accounted for, so
pen-and-paper gives a rough overview of objectives. i can design a speaker
with pen-and-paper only, and still make it sound good (however i need at least
a sound meter).
most modern composers appear to use composition software (possibly in addition
to sequencing software), but i have no experience with this. i'm on the
composition newsgroup sometimes.
michael
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| Pope Jed 2004-11-20, 11:06 am |
| TohuVohu wrote:
> i've always wanted an organ.
> michael
Yeah, I'll bet you have. It's because you are a dickless little
pussyboy. Or did you mean you wanted an organ up your XXX?
Poor little Michael wants a penis. Maybe Santa will bring him one
for Christmas.
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"Ioannis" <morpheus@olympus.mons> wrote in message
news:1100887056.654044@athnrd02...
> Hood wrote:
>
> [snip]
test of[vbcol=seagreen]
without[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> All the more reason for you to appreciate a good fugue, which was
> written without the author *consciously* employing any harmony rules,
> but which turned out to _be_ there, after the fugue was completed,
> nevertheless.
>
> Focus on *not consciously* and _maybe_ you will get the right idea.
>
> Maybe then you'll also understand why I wrote only ONE such fugue and
> then stopped.
I was never a composer Ioannis - I can play and sight read from sheet music
and I can improvise and embellish but compose? No. I wish I could, I wish
I could write one simple tune. Sometimes in class we had to literally
compose for a lesson - something like a song and oh boy I found that hard,
I'll always remember turning up with a song about getting shot in Vietnam
while the rest of the class had done kind of "listen to the wind and the
trees" and "ode to my true love" kind of stuff, I was told by the teacher
not to be so "depressing" in my composition (which hardly encouraged me)!
;)
Michelle
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